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28

Why did Kolkata police murder Rizwanur Rahman?

September 28, 2007 posted by indiatime |

Rizwanur Rahman was a 30-year old computer graphics teacher from Kolkata. He was also a muslim who fell in love with and married a Hindu girl Priyanka Todi, who happened to be the daughter of Ashok Todi, a member of the Todi multimillion dollar Lux hosiery brand (from the banned Lux Cozy underwears ads).

Priyanka eloped and married Rizwanur on August 18, but her family lodged a missing persons report and eventually an abduction complaint against Rizwanur. The Kolkata police started harassing him to return his wife back to her family. Priyanka did not want to go back to her family, but was told by the cops that her father was seriously ill. On september 8th, Rizwanur and Priyanka relented and she went back to live with her family for a week. The family however did not allow Priyanka to return back to Rizwanur.

On September 16, Rizwanur, realising that his wife would not be returned to him, sought help from APDR
(Association for Protection of Democratic Rights) - a human rights organisation (since he wasn’t getting any help from the cops - in fact they were the ones pressuring him).

On September 21, Rizwanur Rahman was found dead, lying on the reilway tracks between Dum Dum and Bidhannagar stations. Within literally minutes, the Kolkata police chief had declared that Rizwanur Rahman had committed suicide. Biman Bose, chairman of the Left Front and a member of the communist polit bureau, told the press that the police had no way of knowing that Rizwanur Rahman and Priyanka were a married couple (in fact the police had negotiated Priyanka’s 1-week stay fully knowing about the marriage - if there were no marriage documents, the police would have arrested Rizwanur for abduction in the first place). After a week-long silence on the issue, the state chief minister Buddhadeb Bhattacharjee finally ordered an investigation in the police involvement of Rizwanur Rahman’s death.

The perpetrators of this ghastly murder must face the brunt of the law with its full force. And the corrupt political establishment that encourages and backs up such inhuman crimes needs to be rooted out and thrown out into the Bay of Bengal. Any police or government that not only doesn’t protect its citizens, but may turn out to be a perpetrating party or an abetting accomplice has no right to police or govern. Their only place in India is behind bars with their necks inside the gallows of justice.

Comments

329 Comments so far

rahul on September 29, 2007 12:52 pm
Had u all protested if rizwanur would have lived with priyanka for a year or two, then in guise of a trip to dubai sold her off.
now i am not a bajrang dal supporter, but this is what happens to females in hands of muslim men.
There is a big diff in the mindset of a mulim and hindu female, the latter cant accept another female in her husband’s life but its common for the former.
would priyanka been happier in a situation like that.
In 99% of hindu femal-muslim male relations, the bride’s family severes all ties with the grl and hence her suffering remains unnoticed,nobody gets to knw she s living or not or sold to a brothel.
NO CANDLE LIGHT MARCH IS DONE FOR HER.
Although i dnt support killing anyone but it is society’s responsibity to stop such atrocities against hindu girls.
Polliticians will continue to appease their vote bank but its time for the larger society to “WAKE UP”.
Yaqub on September 29, 2007 3:23 pm
MR. Rahul u r a great pig. u think all muslim r dalal?tumharay jaisa insan hindu aur muslim main gadbad paida krtay hai, u idiot u dont have any idea of love.
Saqib Firoz on September 29, 2007 6:38 pm
I pity Rahul’s thought, he needs to grow and learn a bit about ISLAM, I invite him for an open minded conversation about my religion, he is free to contact me through my E mail, as about Rizwan the action of mr. ashok Todi, the whole of Calcutta police establishment and the Polititions who are trying to get Political milage of the poor family’s tragedy needs to be condemned, in the harshest words possible. I dont know what Mr. Buddhadeb Bhattacharya will loose if the CBI looks into the matter. Let justice prevail.
adil on September 29, 2007 7:29 pm
rahul ,YOU ARE A WICKED PERSON TRYING TO IGNITE TENSIONS BETWEEN TWO RELIGIONS AND PERSON LIKE YOU ARE SPINELESS THEY ONLY LOOK OUT FOR THEIR BENIFITS
most of the brothels running around are NOT run by muslims.
this case is about the murder of an innocent person whose only fault was that he was financially not as sound as the girls father and belonged to a diff religion.
todi should be given a severe punishment so that on seeing him bear the consequenses of his misdeeds no other very rich and socially well connected person should have a misconception about his power that no matter what he does he can go around freely.
now something about islam, we believe in the life after death where every soul will be either rewarded or punished for his acts.
no matter how long you live the fact remains one day you have to die , so will todi die one day and then he will get to know whether he was right or wrong and so will you.
it is time for JUSTICE AND HUMANITY TO WAKE UP, where every life whether a hindu or muslim, rich or poor should be considered important
indiatime on September 29, 2007 7:36 pm
The real story is the corrupt police who carried out a personal vendetta for a wealthy party and the establishment that tried to cover it all up.

It seems to me that the perpetrators would still have taken the same route had this young girl married someone from another Hindu caste, or someone else that they didn’t approve of.

On another note, nothing in what has come out so far, points to any hints or allegations that the young girl was abused after marriage. There are some reputed human rights organisations involved in this story and they aren’t catering to just Hindus or Muslims.
Sujata Guha on September 29, 2007 10:35 pm
I am a Hindu woman and I can’t express in words what I feel about what this Rahul has to say. He can’t be joking, can he? An upright and decent citizen of India and indeed of the world was killed because of a power hungry and egotistical rich man and because of a police force of one of the largest cities in the world that has no sense of right and wrong.

It is sad that women even coming from such enormously privileged families have no rights. I salute Priyanka for having stood by the allegations that makes the case stronger against her family, since I see many women succumbing to their families in such instances. Further, this goes to show that the couple were not suffering from frivolous infatuation as her family so desperately hoped.

It is shameful that a man had to die to expose the deep prejudices that run in every thread of our lives.
unknown indian on September 30, 2007 2:42 am
rahul,
all that i wish is lets not malign one who is no more, and let s not fooment religious issues here,
arent there enough politicians already waiting to get mileage …
2ndly did you know him
lets pray for his soul that it be in peace and the pepetrators be punished.
iam also not disputing your sentiments(things might have happened in past but
here,
i wish to add one thing
i know his family personally
i had studied with his brother rukbanur in the same school for 12 years, visited his place many a time and of all the people, he his family is not of that kind.not disputing the fact
there might be a bunch of other fantical people, but no not him or his family.it is indeed sad and tragic.iam a hindu brahmin, iyer that too, yet his brother was one of my very good friends..

and i hope and pray that his soul be in peace
Saqib Firoz on September 30, 2007 5:03 pm
Its people like Sujata Guha and unknown indian, who make India a place to live in, I know people like Rahul are a small minority but still they have their say, its now upto us like minded people who claim ourselves to be in the “majority” but still get carried away by the thoughts of pople like Rahul, to make a significant difference.
By the way I too live in Shamsul Huda Road,very close to Rizwan’s house and so am in a very good position to say with confidence that poor Rizwan’s sacrifice (if I may call it one) is being misused by all the Political parities, because I get to hear all the rubbish these petty leaders have to blabber for their political gains.
I know what is done cannot be unone, Rizwan cannot be restored back to his mother, atleast lets not malign the departed soul. Lets do our best to see that Justice prevails. I am willing to help in any way, anyone who wants any kind of help from me can contact me at saqibfiroz@yahoo.com
ahmed on September 30, 2007 6:33 pm
this is for rahul. please dont defame yourself like this ,this only shows the kind of upbringning that u have got,u r simply defaming your parents ……………i know majority of the hindus are unlike u and please let this faith prevail for harmony in this society……….god almighty please forgive rahul for watever he has said
Sam on September 30, 2007 9:53 pm
Rahul you are a MORON who is just trying to change the topic of discussion here. People like you have a place reserved in HELL. Hope u get there soon!

As for the murder, it totally shows the Power of Money!
Aayush Arya on October 1, 2007 12:49 am
Hello!
He was my teacher. I was a student at Arena Multimedia and Rizwan sir taught us Adobe Photoshop and stuff. He was a very jovial person, always very helpful and was loved by every single student. He had a special affection for me. Whenever he used to demonstrate effects on text, he’d use “Aayush Arya” as the sample text (or sometimes, being a fan of Ram Gopal Verma, he’d use “RGV”).

I could not believe my ears when one of my former classmates informed me that Rizwan sir was dead and that he had been brutally murdered. It was a shock of gigantic proportions. The sheer pain and anger I’d felt at that moment cannot be expressed in words. I’ve not even deleted his name from the address book on my phone and the one text message he once sent me (telling me that he liked the new Spider-Man movie) has now become the first “Saved Message” on my cellphone. Meager though they are, they still serve as tiny remembrances for the great person who’d once existed in my life and whom I’ve now lost forever.

Rest in peace, sir. I hope and will pray that your death is avenged and your soul rests in peace. May God bless your family and give them the strength to leave the pain behind and live life with the memories of the happy times they’ve shared with you. Thank you for all that you’ve given to me! I’ll never forget you.

Yours sincerely,
A loving student.
Aayush Arya on October 1, 2007 1:53 am
Please digg this! It only takes a second.

http://digg.com/world_news/
Rizwanur_Rehman_was_brutally_murdered_
Help_the_poor_family_get_justice
Sam on October 2, 2007 8:59 am
Rahul, you are a really PIG.
Rafique on October 2, 2007 3:46 pm
Hi,
You shoud not be prejudiced about religion. Religion is thurst upon us we dont choose it. You inherit this by birth. What is more important is your action your views and your expressions. If a muslim guy does wrong with his wife we all should protest. But this doesnt necessarily mean that we will not protest against injustice done to Rizwanur which is now a symbol of love and nothing else. Everything is almost crystal clear to public. There is no justification in defending criminals. There are people who try to find logic and defense these more amazing to me. This ia a major concern of our society.
Rahul please reply.
Ilassa on October 3, 2007 2:05 am
The muslims cannot tolerate a muslim converting into Hinduism. So there is a possibility of muslim fanatics hand in this death. Riswan was ready to be converted according to the reports.
SB on October 3, 2007 9:37 pm
If you agree, please sign and forward this petition

http://www.petitiononline.com/rrpt0310/petition.html
neil on October 4, 2007 12:59 pm
i abosolutely disagree wid rahul………what way of thnking..mate grow up we al like in a secular society…what happened to rizwanut wa a act of crime and should be punished…it also proves how money is the petrol for running our system of law…..i am sure nuthin will come out of this……ashok todi has a lot of money…he will manipulate the law to his own way and he will be free with the police officers who helped him in the conspiracy…the law being the lollypop in a rich mans hand…money has power but lets see if in bombay sanjay dutt can be sent to jail and in bihar an MP can be senteced to death then why should West Bengal be behind i thnk we shud make an example of this so that he rich pigs who thnk that the law is their dad’s property and police are their house servants……..if this is not done then it is giving this rich pigs anoder chance to use a small fraction of their illegal earnings to wriggle out of the law….they whole system is screwed………i am so ashamed to be a part of this system……….a system which doesnt know the value of a lovers life…
Deb on October 4, 2007 1:20 pm
The question of anyone converting to hinduism is ludicrous. One can be converted into a vaishnavite but not a hindu per se. Anyhow the root cause of this tragic episode was the stark socio economic difference, and marwaaris are very touchy about that, as well as inter religious marriages. For them it’s like a slap on the face. Blind love or not, I think Priyanka Todi shouldve excercised more discretion and thought with her head instead of her heart when she decided to get hitched with rizwan.
Deb on October 4, 2007 1:20 pm
The question of anyone converting to hinduism is ludicrous. One can be converted into a vaishnavite but not a hindu per se. Anyhow the root cause of this tragic episode was the stark socio economic difference, and marwaaris are very touchy about that, as well as inter religious marriages. For them it’s like a slap on the face. Blind love or not, I think Priyanka Todi should’ve excercised more discretion and thought with her head instead of her heart when she decided to get hitched with rizwan.
A question of preferred access : It’s Indiatime on October 4, 2007 5:22 pm
[...] Why did Kolkata police murder Rizwanur Rahman? [...]
SURAJIT on October 4, 2007 11:46 pm
people like rahul are illiterates anyway RIZWANUR’s case is one of the most shocking one
and we still believe we are in the 21st century
while mentality of people like rahul exists in 12th century.
It was rizwan’s unended war
SURAJIT on October 4, 2007 11:47 pm
people like rahul are illiterates anyway RIZWANUR’s case is one of the most shocking one
and we still believe we are in the 21st century
while mentality of people like rahul exists in 12th century.
It was rizwan’s unended war which
SURAJIT on October 4, 2007 11:49 pm
people like rahul are illiterates anyway RIZWANUR’s case is one of the most shocking one
and we still believe we are in the 21st century
while mentality of people like rahul exists in 12th century.
It was rizwan’s unended war which
which he has given a
chance to us (us excludes
SURAJIT&BITHIKA on October 4, 2007 11:59 pm
people like rahul are illiterates anyway RIZWANUR’s case is one of the most shocking one and we still believe we are in the 21st century while mentality of people like rahul exists in 12th century.
It was Rizwan’s unended war which he fought alone with all odds and he which he didn’t lose but could not finish giving us a chance (us excludes religionists like rahul) to say wake up and protest.
His only fault was to love and marry not to a hindu woman but to a daughter of a filthy
rich person who was ultimately responsible for his death with the help of money and power which bought people’s basic ethics.Persons responsible for his death directly or indirectly should be severely punished
so that Rizwan’s soul may rest in
peace.
arjun on October 5, 2007 5:35 am
love is blind isn’t it………as the song goes ishk na puche jaat ishk na puche din dharam………these words only exsist in a fantasy world not real life……..we are defined by our culture our values our religion……its tragic what happened in rizwanur and priyanka’s case…….and yes the culprits should be brought to justice ….even more tragic is what’s gonna follow vote bank politics….the appeasment of the other community by these pseudo secualirsts politicians who are out there demanding justice for votes………tragic isn’t it
Pat on October 5, 2007 6:47 am
Guys, I read most of the replies to this post. Seriously, I am thinking whether there would have been such a loud outcry if a hindu male had eloped a muslim female and had that hindu male being killed but the bride’s family. Having said that, I do not support killing someone on basis of religion and love. But let me ask you all people, how come you know that this guy was not someone who was brainwashed by those clerics who instigate young muslim men to marry hindu girls and convert them to islam? You guys can reply to this post and spit fire but down below its the question you have to ask yourself.

People say that ‘Don’t bring religion in all this’ but you see religion is the main basis of this incident. Hindu girls marrying muslim guys and vice-versa do not understand the ‘Jammen assman ka difference’ between the life-style, thinking and upbringing in these 2 religions. Mostly they suffer after marriage when they are left to die or sold off or whatever. These people know that the girls are their soft target and they go behind them. I have always seen this minority appeasment by our politicians and media. People have to stop giving priority to one religion/community and focus on unity if we want to see our nation move forward.

On a different note, people here trying to bash Hindu supporters who consider themselves secular and indian, where were they when some muslim organizations proposed a ban on muslims singing “Sare jahan se accha”? Where was their patriotism and voice aginst socity? Not all but most of anti-secular elements making noise right now in this post are the ones who want to take advantage of this situation. But we Indians have to be smart and not fall prey.

Jai Hind !! Jai Jawan !! Jai Kisan !!
Shamim on October 5, 2007 1:46 pm
rizwan bhai i will miss u very much, everytime i think of u or read of you i feel like going and killing the ones who killed u.
nirmalya on October 5, 2007 9:19 pm
Well friends!! I have a feeling that the issue is being being projected from a very communal angle without any proper cause.

The question is not of Hiduism or Islam.Because Rizwanur was a student of St.Xaviers college and no so called conversion had taken place.Moreover, he was quite known as a good faculty in Arena Multtimedia.(Please visit Orkut for further reference)

The real tragedy is the way the police allowed themselves to be utilized by the rich people.

If we are at all to protest let us stop buying any product of LUX COZI, the company owned by Priyanka’s father,Ashok Todi.

The police officers and their families involved should also be boycotted for their immoral act.
Max Galstaun on October 5, 2007 11:56 pm
At last the truth behind the Calcutta cops love affair with the filthy, suddenly rich, class has come out in the open. It is sad that it took the death of an innnocent man to bring this out.

If they are paid off, the Calcutta Police will interfere in any and every thing. For years they have been used to harass and intimidate the members of the tiniest minority community in Calcutta. The story of the Armenian Church should be investigated and let that story be exposed too.

Elections are held every four years for the Armenians to elect a Committee to manage the wealthiest trust in Calcutta with an income of Rs 30 crores each year. At each election the police are paid off to manage the gates so that the “Committees” are elected.

In the year 2000, on the eve of the election I was beaten up inside the Armenian College by the Armenian Priest and the Church Committee Members and then “picked up” (from inside the College on Free School st.) by Park St. Police Station and told not to interfere in the election on the next day or I would be arrested on some false charge.

In the year 2005 like Rizwanur Rahman, I contacted the DC headquarters, DC Central and all other Police officers and told them that as a Minority Community we had the right to have an election and attend. At Lalbazar, they agreed that I could go to the meeting as it was not their business to interfere.

The next day I was stopped at the gates of the venue (the Armenian Church, Armenian St. Calcutta Burrabazar P.S.). The smart aleck police constable at the gate knew all the laws !!! (he was well briefed) Then when I protested (I even called Minister Mohd. Salim and told him what was going on) more senior Police officers appeared and openly threatened me with arrest !! I was only one man so why were they paid to stop me ?

Like they interfered with the Rahman family they did the same at our Community meeting. Only 20 Armenians attend, so why are the police paid to harass and intimidate the opposition ? What business they have to interfere in the affairs of the tiniest Armenian community ?

For years, I have campaigned that the Trust income of the Indian Armenian Trusts should be utilised in Calcutta and India. There are urgent needs in Calcutta for the education of Calcutta children.

Instead about 10 crores each year is spent on about 100 FOREIGNERS from Armenia, Russia, Iraq and Iran. Indian children who apply for education on the terms of the Trust are not admitted by the FOREIGN ADMINISTRATOR an Armenian Priest, USA citizen. Are we Indians so dumb that we cannot manage an Indian Trust for the benefit of India ? Do we need administrators from bandit countries like Armenia ?

This fraudulent siphoning of Indian funds to pay for the education of FOREIGNERS has been made possible by the original interference of the Calcutta Police in the elections. Had they not interfered, then PROPER INDIAN ARMENIANS would have controlled and managed the Trusts for the benefit of Indian children and Mother India.

The High Court rules state the ONLY AN ARMENIAN by birth can elect or be elected to the Management Committee. Today, the Managing Committee is : Two foreigners (citizenship unknown!!) One Sikh (who claims to be baptised Armenian!!) one Anglo-Indian, one Bengali..(who claim to be baptised) and ONLY two proper Armenians who can qualify under the High Court rules.

(Baptism does not make on an Armenian. As there are Bengali Hindus, Bengali Muslims and Bengali Christian, one does not become Bengali by religion !!!)

So the funds will be continue to be looted for the benefit of foreigners !!

CRY MY POOR COUNTRY !!!

THANK YOU CALCUTTA POLICE FOR MAKING IT IMPOSSIBLE FOR INDIANS TO GET AN EDUCATION IN AN INDIAN ARMENIAN TRUST !!! YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY GREAT !!

I pray for Rizwanur and his family daily.

MAX GALSTAUN

http://www.calcutta-armenians.blog.co.uk
Realist Kumar on October 6, 2007 9:00 pm
ladies gentlemen and others who are concerned;

I am a lover of hindi films and can often tell the ending withing teh first two reels - so how will this contemporary story of a love gone bad unravel?
(1.) Jamat-e-Ulema-e-Hind leader Siddiqullah Chowdhury also visited Rehman’s family and called for a compensation of Rs 1 crore. “There should be an impartial investigation and Priyanka should be returned to the family,” said Chowdhury. http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Rehman-committed-suicide-says-police-chief/220512/
(2.) CID is probing and they will most probaby clear everyone.
(3.) Mr. Todi will pay the one crore that Siddiqullah Chowdhury has asked for.
(4.) Lawyer for family said “We filed a supplementary affidavit before the court of Justice Soumitra Pal to make Snehashis Ganguly a party in the case as he has confessed to his role in introducing Todi to the city’s top cop,” Kalyan Bandyopadhyay, the family lawyer, told reporters - smart move here.
http://www.indianmuslims.info
/news/2007/oct/03/souravs_brother_be_summoned_
rizwanur_rahmans_death_case.html

He will make some money out of this!
(5.) Priyanka Todi wil be sent to America to live with cousins and recover.
(6.) all will soon be forgotten and the Kolkata students will get a good few days off to enjoy themselves for a social cause!
(7.) Poor lover boy computer graphics teacher is off course dead meat - I feel sorry for you Rizwan!
(8.) news channels will make a lot of money on this.

Story over and as we all know mera bharat mahan!
Toron Sarkar on October 6, 2007 10:30 pm
I am appalled this happened. Rahul and Pat, please have the sense to realize that it would have been equally sad if they were buddhist, jain, jewish, catholic, protestant, non-marwaris, anglo-indians, or eskimos. Their religion or caste or rase is entirely besides the point here. Where is your humanity? I happen to be a hindu, and believe people’s lives are not less valuable based on either their monetary worth or religion. Lets show respect to rizwanur who gave away his life because some people thought otherwise.
Toron Sarkar on October 6, 2007 10:51 pm
Max Galstaun, sorry to hear your story. At least you are alive to say it! I want to congratulate you for your spirited but lawful fight against muscle power. My advice to you will be to try to mobilize more people in the Armenian church behind your cause. But with all due respect sir, missionaries spend foreign money to help Indian children, so I don’t see wrong-doing in spending Indian money for foreign applicants, provided they are deserving. But you are a better judge, I don’t know the cause for which Armenian Church was established which you do i am sure.
mita agrawal on October 7, 2007 5:57 am
IT IS VERY UNFORTUNATE THAT STILL WOMEN ARE CONSIDERED AS PROPERTY BY EVERY COMMUNITY. THEY DO NOT HAVE RIGHT TO CHOICE FOR THEMSELVES. I am also a hindu girl brought up in a very Muslim dominated area in hydrabad.Everybody say about Rizwan but I will say greatest loser is PRIYANKA TODI. how? 1st- she lost her beloved husband.2nd-She lost her reputation.3rd-she lost her family trust.and many more.Frankly speaking, in my school and college carrier I am being approached by many Muslim guys but I have never dreamed about them. But after priyanka case I got sure that I am in right path.I will suggest priyanka to be extra careful and not to lose more at least now. Women should more careful than men .We cant change our society but it is certain that we can change ourselves. We cant live without our society.I request every women belonging to each community should understand and learned a lesson from it.Because we will be greatest looser at the end like Priyanka. PRIYANKA ALL THE BEST FOR REST OF UR LIFE…DON’T LISTEN TO ANYBODY. IT IS THE TIME TO USE YOUR MIND NOT HEART DO NOT LOOSE MORE BLINDLY. WISEST MAN IS WHO LEARNED LESSON FROM OTHERS FAULT. THANK YOU PRIYANKA FOR MAKING ME TO LEARN SOMETHING.
Meghna on October 7, 2007 1:00 pm
Well Mita, are you actually suggesting tht women should do just as they are bid by the society because we “can’t change the society”? Will this really solve the problem? Basically, you are taking the safest way out to save your own skin without stirring up any more trouble. Its the perspective that matters. Therefore, if you go against the society and do anything that they do not support, you’ll have to face the music. Am not saying that you should keep rebelling etc, but why should you need to rebel or play safe for that matter? Its about doing what you believe is right.

Granted that you should use your brains depending on the situation, but if you can’t stand up for your beliefs, what’s the point of all these claims to women’s lib, education, financial independence and the rest? Its all a sham then. And this goes for both men and women.

Its easy to blame it all on religious differences and love and stupidity etc, but the bottomline is that Rizwanur is dead and it is prob becoz of socio-eco issues than relg. Granted that one should be careful about their relationships etc, but then the background of a person can easily be checked. For a family as well placed like the Todis,that wudn’t have been very difficult. Besides, one can’t get involved overnight in such activities; in order to traffick, you must be knowing someone in the biz and the transaction must have been going on for some time. If you really want to check u on a person, you can keep tabs on him and find out about the people he meets and so on and so forth. Also, may I point out that a person’s religion doesn’t determine their involvement in human trafficking and/or other such activities? Your spouse/partner might be from your socio-eco strata and still be an anti-social element.

There’s this extremely moronic idea that if you do just as you are told, you will be fine and safe. Time and again we have seen it fail, yet we believe in it. Please understand that there will always be at least two parties in any conflict and none of them will be in power throughout. Who will you listen to? and if they have that much power, why would they need you to listen to them, they can make you do whatever they want to.

For everyone who wants to play safe,what happened to Rizwanur might just as easily happen to any of us tomorrow and our religion/ social status/ money/ won’t help us at that time. As they say, “a dead man tells no tales”. No one will no the real reason or what really happened and gradually, it will become a mundane affair. So playing safe won’t get you anywhere. Closing your eye will only stop you from seeing what’s going on, but it won’t stop the actual incidents. And you or yours won’t really be safe because of this “wise” action. You see, this is a violation of out fundamental rights and will ultimately lead to a totalitarian society. This kind of an incident should not be allowed to go unnoticed.
vivek on October 7, 2007 4:31 pm
If you look the entire episode then you will find 2 vital ingredients which has put this story on media top chart. These are as:
1. There was a Muslim male person involved .
2. And the opponent was big industrialist.
If you take take out any of the above then it would not even reported in any news paper.

Now since the dead person was Muslim ,therefore the entire Muslim community had come in his support and put Kolkata on hold. (there are so many murder/death in our country but we hardly find such public outcry,motivated by vested interest) After that it became a big issue for all political party and an good issue for media.
I still can’t find out a single instance where a chief minister had to clarify on such petty issue. In India there are around 100 or more unnatural death daily on an average basis. Do that get the same focus and attention.

We are stupid that we all (specially Media) that we are giving so much attention to a case created by few vested political parties along with Muslim cluster. The entire case is still under investigation and let the course of law take its own course.

More it was not perfect love case.A perfect love requires at least 5 years of understanding. In fact Ms. Priyanka was hypnotized by rizwanur rehman being her Tutor and 8 years older by her.He joolly well knew her status and thus he planed to marry her and carefully tread the web of love. Priyanka at tender age of 20 does not understand much and move gradually towards him without thinking at all about the future. Once you are in fire of love its difficult to get out it .It’s only after some mis happening one can get out of it or you need a strong will power/brain .
Anony-MUS(K). on October 7, 2007 6:37 pm
Know what Rahul?? Your statement just goes on o show that you didn’t receive proper education in Moral Science, especially from your parents. I am a Hindu by birth only, otherwise I’m an atheist by my own choice. Listen, if Priyanka died there would have been a candlelight march for her too. She is alive, yesm, she is suffering a lot now that she has become a widow but nonetheless she is alive. Rizwanur won’t ever return, that is why this candlelight vigil is for him. How ignorant of you to suggest about brothels being run by Muslims etc.!! Is your religion your identity or is your humanity your identity?? Rahul, YOU ARE MORE THAN A PIG!! Please don’t send foolish comments and spark fury amongst people belonging to different faiths. Man, you should have been in the place of Rizwanur, the world needs people like him, not scum like you!!
Another murder? Similar patterns. at on October 7, 2007 8:47 pm
[...] The story is not new, we have heard this many times before. What is, however, striking about this incident is the collusion between the Kolkata police and the businessman Ashok Todi. The police had intervened in the marriage by threatning the boy, when his body was found on the railway tracks with no visible wound marks except strangulation on his neck, they called it suicide and when the Kolkata police was questioned, the Commissioner stated that it “was” the business of the police to intervene in domicile matters of marriage in such situations. A CBI report states that it was suicide but no forensic evidence is being made public. I understand that there is a media outcry over this issue. Please do let us know more about this. Read the outline of the incident here. [...]
peter paul on October 7, 2007 9:11 pm
I feel this kind of discussion can only happen in a country like INDIA where at least the freedom of man is appreciated and any inhuman action is condemned.

If you feel angry with rahul’s comment please visit SAUDI ARABIA and the behaviour of our fellow indian minority and express your opinion.

I condemn this wrong doing but I feel rahul also has a right to express himself as this is a free land.
Kamna on October 7, 2007 10:17 pm
Whoever you are rahul,you people create these kind of situation.you have a right to say n express your point but look at the situation.in todays world its sick to even hear of these kind of things.
He treid to fight for his love n fought against everthing jsut to have his wife back.his life was taken in the process.wht justice is this?
Its really a shocking event.I just wish his family would get justice as soon as possible.
I admire the way he fought,and im sure he would get justice.
rajiv on October 8, 2007 12:09 am
well Rahul religion,caste, creed , money and all other materialistic figments of human imagination that supposedly grant people their honour were and always will be made for man….man was not made for them……taking a life on their pretext is akin to being racist….and believe me in life what goes around always comes around…so be careful what u send around…it might just come around and bite your ass off…

I doubt if people like you have the courage to stand up for something like this guy did….hindu or muslim or any other religion ur spineless kind always runs and hides when the going gets tough…

so remember to kindly keep ur fundamenalist mob mentality BS to urself will you
Jish Bhattacharya on October 8, 2007 2:11 am
Hats off to hindu bengalis for short-sightedness. Looks like bangla commies are guilt sticken and self-loathing folks. When hindu women and children are raped and murdered by mollahs in neighboring b’desh(shit), media and the anti-hindu leftists remain silent.
And there’s no moulavi,Shabana Azmi,Brinda karat or Arundhati Roy to listen to their plight.

Name me few nupital instances of hindu male and a muslim female.(Barring few bollywood instances!). Thanks to secular brainwashing going on in West Bengal.

Wake up Hindus…
Pawan on October 8, 2007 2:41 am
I do fully agree that taking someoneâ€™s life is totally against humanity and barbarian act, which cannot be subscribed & endorsed by any civilized society.

Having said that, I differ from the popular opinion that Rizwanur was right in marrying the daughter of Ashok Todi, who happens to be a rich man.

First reason put forth is that both are major and are independent to take the decision about their life including to whom they will marry.

Let me make it very clear that legally a major that is one who has attained the age of 18 years is capable of making a decision, which is right about him or her. But in practice even the age of eighteen, nineteen or for that matter twenty is a tender age, which doesnâ€™t understand the implications, difficulties, challenges of life. Besides this is the age where a girl or boy mostly influenced by movies, the word love excites them a lot etc. This is the age, where any one with well planned intention can woo, persuade and entice them to take such decision which is not right for them.

Let us go in to the attending circumstances as to how a girl of a millionaire falls in love with a mediocre man. Just like on a plain surface it seems like rizawanur has been murdered. To me on plain surface, it seems like it is he, who has taken the initiative knowing well that by marrying the daughter of a millionaire overnight he will become a millionaire. He has used the tender age of the girl & the faulty law to fall prey of the so called love.

Let us examine the social position. You know that there is a law to punish rape. The punishment for rape is 7-10 years of rigorous imprisonment. What happens in the act of rape & a sexual relation with consent? The difference is absence of consent and in many cases forcefully indulging in sexual act. What is the result physically? In most cases it is nothing much. But the rape victim & her family undergo mental agony, humiliation. And for this reason is the punishment.

Similarly those who advocate that the love marriage involving inter racial members, financial imbalance totally disregard the pain & humiliation it inflicts on the family of the girl, which is equally humiliating & painful as in the case of rape.

Let me tell you that if I fall in love with a girl, who is as rich as todi & I am of a financial position of Rizwanur, I will not marry the girl, till I make myself capable of providing a decent & matching lifestyle, what she is already in. Otherwise you all wise people know that so called pyar ka bhoot, kuchh hi dino mein uttar jayega. And then there will be daily quarrels & a very unhappy ending. ( if the father of the girl doesnâ€™t consent to the marriage). I will do everything to make myself so much capable & worthy so that I can go up to the father of the girl & ask for her hand.

Let us examine from the angle of the parents & family of the girl, who will not feel good & happy about their daughter. Besides the humiliation they have to suffer every day in the society they live. You all are aware about that, whether you accept that or not. This humiliation is nothing less than a rape victim.

Coming back to the legal position, I am of the strong opinion that the law is the mirror of current civilized setup. Where ever the law does not reflect the current socio positions this kind of cases are bound to happen. Let me ask you learned peoples that the law lays down that every persons who attains the age of 18 is capable of making his or her own decision. Does it not surprise you that a person who is as on today 17 years 364 days old is not capable of making the decision about what is good or bad about himself or herself? And suddenly the very next day he or she becomes mature & perfectly capable to make a decision about his or her life.

Beside this every individual is different and when one really becomes really capable of making the right decision about his or her life cannot be guided by the rule of thumb of age i.e. 18 years. It is not about casting a vote. It is about life.

Therefore in the circumstances like this, where there is a big divide of caste, financial position and in particular parents consent is absent, the law should be changed and age for marriage should be changed to at least 21, where at least the girl leaving a house of parents will be more mature to assess her good or bad.
JyothiBasu on October 8, 2007 3:45 am
Nothing happens with out the will of Allah.
RITIKA on October 8, 2007 12:37 pm
If allah is so unjust,I m sorry! I would better not believe in him. Rahul, do u belong to this century? Did u go to school ever? What are u talking about? If u happened to see ‘We The People’ on NDTV yesterday,may be you could get some idea of the heights of ignorance u have.Think before u speak.We all stand united in Rizwanur’s case. Justice should prevail. Let not this be another case where power subdues all. Let not an indian heart bleed again. We the people of India, cry for justice for rizwanur.Its high time when people should rise above inter caste and inter faith marriages.Keep a revolver on the heads of such hipocrites and ask if they still believe in the same principles! An average indian has an expected life of about 63.9 years out of which 20 years go in studying. Cant we lead the rest 40 in peace considering all our brotheren? We all are the same . We eat,we breathe,we laugh,we fall sick,we talk,we fall in love,we cry and finally we all die.If a muslim family doesnt feel cold in winters n hot in summers like your family,dont marry ur daughter to them. But if they do,dont cheat yourself!Rizwanur is an excellent example of a tolerant muslim of the 21st century.I salute his spirit, I bow down to his love.He indeed shall get justice! May his soul rest in peace!
patriotic hindu on October 8, 2007 12:45 pm
It is unfortunate that Rizwanur Rahman had to pay with his life. However he took this risk fully aware about the consequences of his actions . It is still very difficult for any Hindu family to accept that one of its daughters eloped and married a Muslim. However killing was not the solution. It is very difficult to determine who is right or wrong. Girls and Boys in their early twenties are still emotionally immature and cannot really understand the consequences of their actions. Although we consider, by law, that 18 is the age of being a major somehow practically it does not happen.

I would like to say that Love is an important and wonderful thing but to add a measure of caution the couple must see that they have a long life ahead and that they would have to live in society and family. No matter what one says, society and family stills plays an important part in the life of any Indian. It would take immense effort on the part of both parties to bridge the families which i think in the present case would be difficult if not impossible.
Mrs Kaul on October 8, 2007 12:49 pm
The Rizwanur-Priyanka saga is a blatant example of uncalled for and UNLAWFUL interference in the essentially private domain called marriage between two consenting adults. All involved in planning, aiding,abeting and execution of such act should be handed out harshest punishment. Ashok Todi after all that he has done through his CHAMCHA s in the Police department at the end of the day must accept that HE IS RIZWANUR REHMAN’S FATHER-IN-LAW and now HIS DAUGHTER PRIYANKA IS A WIDOW. In addition to these he should be behind bars immediately as he is a threat to civilized society
RITIKA on October 8, 2007 12:54 pm
@ pat

Investigation is on but somehow we all have accepted that rizwanur was right and ashok todi was wrong. We are all emotional people. We follow what our gut feeling says. I saw Rizwanur’s brother on tv,his eyes were innocent. If i am wrong at judging people,i would prefer to be wrong but i shall follow my heart.This is what a common indian thinks…and about the anti-secular ,anti social elements-we the educated ones,the tolerant ones,the wise ones have to outnumber them any day and teach our children to grow upo to be like us in the hope that one day india would not have religion issues left! We can fight against them by not following their way and inspiring people around us to do the same.
RITIKA on October 8, 2007 12:57 pm
@pat

my gut feeling says Rizwanur is innocent. Even if i am fooled because of beleiving what my heart says,I still believe in it. This is how a common indian is.
Rahul on October 8, 2007 3:20 pm
I strongly feel that the Todi’s must have paid a large sum of money to get his daughter out of this marriage.So acting on his wishes he Pays the Ruling party office a huge sum of money through the Administrative officers.
Eventually the party could not simply sack these three, Including the commissioner.
But instead played a trick to baffle the citizens of Kolkata as well as india.
The judicial enquiry is also an eye wash , when every one knows that It must be carried out with a Judge who is working & not a retired one.
Cm is simply passing on time and waiting for things to settledown by time.
vivek on October 8, 2007 4:38 pm
I fully agree with Pawan for his boldness. I must reproduce as what he wrote and thereafter I will give my views:
“Let me tell you that if I fall in love with a girl, who is as rich as todi & I am of a financial position of Rizwanur, I will not marry the girl, till I make myself capable of providing a decent & matching lifestyle, what she is already in. Otherwise you all wise people know that so called pyar ka bhoot, kuchh hi dino mein uttar jayega. And then there will be daily quarrels & a very unhappy ending. ( if the father of the girl doesnâ€™t consent to the marriage). I will do everything to make myself so much capable & worthy so that I can go up to the father of the girl & ask for her hand.=
=======================
Rizwanur knew Prinyaka is sweet ,innocent and a daughter of rich businessman. So he meticulously planed to achieve her. Since he was a sweet and gullible talker, so gradually and carefully he initiated his friendship with her ,which he nursed and made Prinyaka complete blind. He must given lot of promises/sweet word like I like hinduism /vegetrain food etc.very much. After patoed completely, he must given his state of affairs as he is from a very poor family background and some other weakness as now Prinyaka (being completely blind)would not mind and will appreciate.
If I love someone, I will put myself under lot of restriction in order to be comparable and give comforts to the other partner. Love is nothing but to sacrifice for each other. We all have seen that Prinyaka under blind faith had sacrifice a lot to but can we see any sacrifice by rizwanur ?
Today he has become a martyr.Only because of Prinyaka and her family.
Lot more in next………..
Radha on October 8, 2007 5:19 pm
What Crap,Mr.Rahul. You are saying all muslim men sell women? Generalise much?

And there’s a difference in the male and female mindset IRRESPECTIVE of religion. And if her family disowns her for making a decision about HER life,shame on them.And SHE is not the dead person,why should there be a candle light vigil?

Ptiyanca would have been happier if her decision as an ADULT was not interfered with.No way can she be happy being a widow,losing the man she loved.

Its a shame that in these modern times people have thoughts like yours.There are a large number of hindu/muslim marriages that are very successful in this country.

This is about class,not religion.Please let us not use this to draw racial lines and divide the society.
Radha on October 8, 2007 5:25 pm
I have one more thing to say.Reading stuff here,people seem to be missing the major point.The police who is supposed to PROTECT the public,irrespective of class or creed have been complicit in murdering a young man. It does not matter what his religion is,who he married,he did nothing ILLEGAL.He did not desrve to DIE or be punished in any way.Bottomline is the POLICE are murderers here.That is the ultimate shame.
Radha on October 8, 2007 5:47 pm
Mr Patriotic HINDU…

According to you MARRYING out of caste is RISKING one’s life now?

I am sick of hearing how difficult its for them to adjust cos of their religious differences. ITS THEIR LIFE.WTH are WE to decide what’s too difficult for them? They are ADULTS.They can make their own decisions and if its a mistake,they can learn from it and stand up again.WE,or her parents have no right to take the decision out of her hands.If we allowed this,women will once again be regressed to propert of men in this society.As puppets who have no right to think on thier own and will be dominated by the men in the name of protection.
Aritra Roy on October 8, 2007 5:48 pm
The police commisioner and all the other police involved in it should be strictly punished.The father of priyanka todi should be arrested for masterminding a murder.
PK on October 8, 2007 5:52 pm
It’s a well observed practice of a civilized society to pay homage and respect to the departed soul. Rizwanur is no more so let us not malign him once because he is not around to defend himself.

I also pity those demented guys who are going overboard to laud and approve the relationship of Rizwanur & Priyanka and trying to get milage out of the issue. I stongly hope that truth should prevail and justice should be done. However we cannot wish away the fact that there existed a big chasm of socio-cultural and economic divide between them leaving aside the religious difference.

In the same token it is incongruous to think that the parents should accept the inanities of the children and live with social stima all through their lives.

It does not mean that I subscribe to the theory of intimidating or killing of a person who does not see reasons and realities of life. It should be clear that no one has right to take somebody’s life under any circustances.

Moreover I believe that we, the followers of great time tested religion called Sanatan Dharma, which is eternal in nature and has all inclusive connotation unlike Muslim, Christian, Jew or Zorostrian etc. who are highly indoctrinated to believe in one book and one God ( let us do not call ourselves us mere Hindus ), embraces all without exception. As a result we have never felt threatened and have never mounted any crusade against anyone through out our history inspite of various invasions to our country. Therefore loss of any sigle life is like loss of our own kith and kin……”Vasudhaiav kutumbakam”.

I have heard someone’s suggestion to fight the injustice the Gandhigiri way is commendable. We’re all with you.
Radha on October 8, 2007 5:52 pm
Mr Vivek,

Did you know Rizanwur in person? Did you read his mind? You seem to know his thoughts in great detail.HTH can you assume his motives? It IS possible for 2 people to fall in love.Just becos one is poor does not make it a plan.You know how insulting it is to the girl to play her as a foolish mindless woman who anyone can manipulate? Give her some credit.Women DO have brains.Is it possible this could have turned out to be a mistake,sure.But we’ll never klnow now,will we? Cos the man was murdered.

And YKW,even if his motives weren’t pure,its still no reason to have him killed.All these ‘it wsa wrong to murder..BUT..’ statments sound to me like its justifying the murder and that sickens me to the stomach.
Radha on October 8, 2007 5:57 pm
MR. PK,

Its NOT an Inanity for 2 adults to marry a partner of their choice.I am sorry if it does not match the parents idea of right,but its not wrong at all.Parents have to accept that children grow up and have a mind of their own.And the Childrens happiness and their trust in them must matter more than what the supposed Society says.Society can’t make the kids happy.So now they have killed the man their daughter loves.Guess society is satisfied.They can hold their heads up hight now.But what about priyanca? Does she not desrve happiness? And i don’t buy the ’she could not have been happy marrying a muslim boy’ crap.That’s a huge generalisation and extremely unfair
Rajib Banerjee on October 8, 2007 6:33 pm
Rahul, its people like you who give us Indians a bad name and Boy, you are better off in Narendra Modi’s Gujarat or if per chance, you get hold of a time machine, in Hitlers’ Poland as the SS Commandant of Auschwitz.

When decent people like Rizwanur, keep dying, the biggest question that we face, is what sort of society do we live in? Can we ever hope to have a truly civil society, where the Indian Constitution and the rule of law shall reign supreme?

Think you bigot, the pain that the mother is having who has lost her son in the alter of inhumanity.

Shame Kolkata, I feel ashamed to call myself a resident of this city, the supposed cultural capital of India.

And Rahul, get hold of a pscyho quick or better, go live in Mugabe’s Zimbabwe.
Reena on October 8, 2007 6:45 pm
It is absolutely ridiculous, the state leaders talking about social welfare and lecturing on anti-capitalism is just for show, they do not know the meaning in reality and where has the democracy gone, why cannot two adults marry on their will? what does the police or state has to do with it in the first place. And above all the state is taking so long to react and respond to this issue!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I completely support view of Mr. Yaqub about rahul……Rahul needs to brush up his facts and get over his uneducated mindset! There are happily married hindu-muslim couples living and will continue to live if people like you stop bothering them….
Girls are grown up to decide and later bare the consequence, the large society has no business to show them light….what would you say about the dowry deaths and wife beating in a perfectly arranged hindu-hindu marriage????
amites on October 8, 2007 8:09 pm
I don’t know who this rahul is, don’t want to know him. I don’t think he needs to be answered.
Rizwanur’s death is a shocking event. It shows how an ordinary citizen is treated in a country that is’democratic’. we as members of civil society (if that still exists in India!)must act immediately.
Vishnu on October 8, 2007 8:11 pm
@ rahul

that was the most pathetic statement ever made..you’re outta your mind…
RahulDev on October 8, 2007 8:29 pm
Dear Friends ,
I think you people mistook me and started charging me.
I am RahulDev.

I strongly feel that the Todiâ€™s must have paid a large sum of money to get his daughter out of this marriage.So acting on his wishes he Pays the Ruling party office a huge sum of money through the Administrative officers.
Eventually the party could not simply sack these three, Including the commissioner.
But instead played a trick to baffle the citizens of Kolkata as well as india.
The judicial enquiry is also an eye wash , when every one knows that It must be carried out with a Judge who is working & not a retired one.
Cm is simply passing on time and waiting for things to settledown by time.
The Party who rules West Bengal Controls Police too.
Her Police has the full authority to do anything they wish with the public.
Our CM previously was the Police Minister.& the Police always tries to Please him.
The ruling Party never Tries to harm The Moslems,but some how this time Money made them make this mistake.
Now they are just searching for something to lure our Views.
It’s really a pity that this thing happened here in bengal.
But we are all just onlookers & apart from consoling their relatives we cant do anything m coz telling anything against this party people gets killed too.
Save west bengal Indians.
Jish Bhattacharya on October 8, 2007 9:23 pm
How often have you heard successful marriages between Rajib and Razia or between Sanjay and Fatima ? Even if it remotely occurs,Rajib is brutally killed and our secular media remains in total denial.
Two of my close acquaintances married mollah boys and are in tears after 15 years of marriage. Its called bonded servitude of hindu girl and getting abused within. Mollah men have an expansionist policy right from inception to elope non-mollah women.Else , Islam would finish !

Had the girls were smart,practical and their father took action, they would have been better off today.
Kaushik on October 8, 2007 11:08 pm
Yes I think, Calcutta Police is directly involved..

These filthy creatures should be thrown out of their

service making them incapable of using their accounts,

money or whatever they have earned legally or

illegally.. forcing them to live like beggers,

punishment apart. Had a civilian or a criminal

committed such things irrespective of the reason, he

would have been thrown behind bars but these uniformed

criminals know that they can easily escape.. We should

remember that they are actually a bunch of cowards and

that is why they can only dare to committ as long as

they enjoy their power. Of late we learned from a TV

channel that DC HQ Gyanwant Singh used to collect bribe

worth Rs.40 lacs every month. Why are we surprised

hearing that ? We should know that Police collects

bribe in different forms, most clearly can be seen on

streets.. Traffic Police collects bribe from Trucks

and vehicles.. That bribe is shared from the bottom

to the top; everyone enjoys their share little or more

in amount. They even issue unofficial membership cards

to the truck owners who pay in lumpsum and thus they

are not disturbed by the police if they show the card

to the police. Amazing system of corruption created by

a bunch of corrupt coward people and ofcourse they are

criminals. Actually we are living in a fake democracy..

These filthy pigs(irrespective of uniformed or

uniformed bureaucrats) and their families feed on the

taxes paid by us.. these two-legged creatures always

shun to acknowledge that they are public servants..

and I just am surprised how badly they behave with

ordinary people while the truth is that because of

these ordinary people, these bureaucrats enjoy

unimaginable luxuries as a pedler sleeps on the

pavement.

Bureaucrats wherever you see whether it be in Police or in Railways or in any organizaion, mostly are corrupt and before this engulfs the whole country, we young people should take initiatives to expose these filthy nasty corrupt creatures and throw them out of our human society.. Let all bravehearts join our hands irrespective our religion caste or creed.. PLEASE!! Let us be human beings, not dumb brainless stubborn cowards..
Juzer on October 8, 2007 11:09 pm
Our constitution is ruled by criminals what justice does a family expect. May god bless you rizwan
Juzer on October 8, 2007 11:16 pm
Well Mr.Rahul,

You will surely see more muslims and hindu marriages soon. Because the young generation does not support people having a sick mind like you. We are independant and lets stick by it friends. Lets all support Rizwan and burn the candle light.
Rahu on October 9, 2007 12:15 am
No sin gets by the Lord unnoticed. No matter how small or great, every act of disobedience is noted by the Lord God. With every opportunity given to man/woman to fall into the temptation to sin, there will ALWAYS without a doubt, simultaneously be given a way of escape thus we are without excuse. It will be the responsibility of each individual to accept that way of escape, or succumb to the temptation and give into sin. Be consciously aware, that before you surrender to the â€œwill of the fleshâ€, and give in to the lust thereof, ultimately â€œSin Produces Deathâ€. A continual, willful act of disobedience will lead to death.
Viswanath on October 9, 2007 2:26 am
A tutor is not supposed to love and marry his student.He was 10 yrs older than her. What the parents will do if tutors and teachers started to behave like this. I feel pity for the idiots engaged in anti Todi propaganda. All these creatures have only utter contempt for their parents. Todi has got every right to ensure his daughter’s welfare.

Todi must be punished if had committed any crime. But if it was a suicide you can blame nobody except the doer.
Pat on October 9, 2007 3:43 am
To likes of all Ritikas and Radhas,

It seems that you guys knew this Rizwan pretty well and so you vouche for his ENDLESS ETERNAL UNENDING love for Priyanka. I agree that he would have been truely in love but you also have to look at the other angle where he might just have married Priyanka for her social status or some other reason.

The fact is that we are in no position to comment who was right and who was wrong because we do not know the exact situation. By exact situation I mean, the mindset of the guy and the girl, the guys intension, the emotional stress on the girl’s family.

If you truely love your parents, please take some similar step and see what your father or brother or as a matter of fact any of your family member does in response. You both think that you have matured enough to give such bold statements and vouche for the VOICE of WOMEN but a matter of fact is that you do not know what the exact emotional circumstances are and are in no position to comment.

Having said that, my stand would be the same if someone would have vouched for the VOICE of MEN. The bottom line being, there are too much emotions involved in such matters and you only relaize it if someting like this happens to you.

I am not against Rizwan or priyanka nor with them. Because, I for sure do not know whther they acted imaturely bringing grive to their respective families or did they do the right thing and fell prey to the bloody emotional outcome.
Pat on October 9, 2007 3:52 am
Each and every person in the world has to be responsible be his/her decisions. A person’s decision does not just affect him/her but it affects a lot of people. This case is a very good example. So people have to be really careful.

If you say that I am in love and I do not care for my parents nor for anyone else and have the RIGHT to take the decision, then you are gravely mistaken because this is not what relationships are built on. This is what is called SELFISHNESS where you just think of ones self. I hope such people, who do not care for realtionships, come alone in this world, live alone and die alone.
Pat on October 9, 2007 3:56 am
Nor do I support such parents who for once are not ready to listen to their children and try to impose their will always. But in this case you don’t know what conspired between the girls and her parents as well as the bou and her family. So we all are in no position to comment nor give our individual verdicts.
Jayakrishnan on October 9, 2007 3:58 am
Its something that I can never come to terms with in my entire life.Its a shame I couldnt do anything for my close mate.There’s certainly some kind of learning from this.Im not asking everyone to follow Gandhigiri if not possible atleast just give someone’e life the same respect that one gives to self.If you would had the opportunity to meet him you would have known he was certainly one to cherish.Please use the basic sense when confronting something like this.Its important to understand that money status power all these things can come at any time if there is faith and patience however you cant get back your loved ones when such a dastardly act is inflicted upon.I never had a good relationship with a Muslim Im a brahmin,this relationship had taught me humans should always stick together just as that and not let religion caste race overpower it.And for the suicide part its a DAMN FOOLISH JOKE
russel on October 9, 2007 7:35 am
This story seems to be a replay of Devdas in reverse since the girl is rich and boy is poor.

it is being sensationalised because of religion difference but the difference in economic status is being ignored.

If they were really in love why could they not wait for a few years when the girl also becomes economically independent?
Annu Jalais on October 9, 2007 8:22 am
This is such a shame on the West Bengal govt, the Kolkata police ..how long will you keep criminalising love that doesn’t fit the restrictive parameters of religion, caste and class?? This is such a heinous heinous act; I hope the criminals will be brought to justice. The govt will need to do something about rooting out prejudices from WB before its cancerous tentacles decimates anyone who dares love outside the box..
Rajib Banerjee on October 9, 2007 9:26 am
Hi Pat and Hi to Vishwanath, too, the question lies in every individual’s inalienable right to decide his/her own fate. And how does parents or the society come in between.

And Rahu, you are better of seating on the pavements of Dharamtola selling magical roots and stones, speaking of TEMPTATION, REDEMPTION AND SIN, you sound like some preacher for KLU KLUX KLAN.

Why don’t you friends accept the basics, that in my country, people still die because they dare to dream?

And RahulDev, I was speaking of the other Rahul who has completely lost his marbles yaar, speaking of Hindu Girls and Muslim men and servitude and other medieval stuff… Utter rubbish!
Sheikh Jellar Rehman on October 9, 2007 9:52 am
Rizwanur had done the greatest mistake by not involving the press or media from the begining otherwise his life would have been saved.This point must be noted.If this case is not unearthed properly the ruling party may lose in the coming election, their machinary will not work properly.Once again it is proved that money / muscle power can do everything. J.Rehman
A True Indian Woman on October 9, 2007 9:55 am
I think people like Rahul should be thrown on the railway tracks,because its them who are a threat,not only to women but to the entire community,for igniting tension between two religions.
He is a hypocrite.
Although he is aware that brothels are run by Hindu’s as well as Muslims,he points at one religion unneccesarily,knowing that this will give rise to a communal issue.

Rahul,what if your sister or daughter would have married a Muslim guy?
Would you have gone and killed him just because he is a muslim,even though he loves the lady dearly?
Who would you push into suffering in turn?
Have you ever thought in human terms about this?
You spoke about “Candle light March”.
Do you even know why is it done?
You’ve spoke about atrocities against Hindu girls.But the sad fact is,you are not even aware of the context in which it should be referred to.
Here the atrocity was against Rizwanur and Priyanka by her family and the police.
And NOT by muslims against a hindu girl.
Got it you hypocrite??
YOU WAKE UP and then speak to the larger society before we trample people like you.
Nayab on October 9, 2007 12:22 pm
i just want to say the rahul that if your own brother was brutally murdered in the same way than what will be the feeling of your mother,father and offcource yours. just feel it than you can understand the relationship. its not a matter of hindu-muslim, its a matter of justice. for your information, as per survey in india most of brothel are running by non muslim.
you will find every where some good people and some bad people. you can not blame the whole community. do you think that you never done a sin? try to change your attitude.
vivek on October 9, 2007 1:25 pm
Let me be clear that Rizwanurâ€™s death is a shocking event and don’t appreciates such unnatural death even for a rat.
Death penalty is not the solution for any evil.Talk,talk talk and give time time time to resolve all the issues.
Why I am against rizwanur as selfishly he jumped into wedlock without thinking about the future.
There was no hurry from Priyanka as she was only 22 years. If he really loved her from the bottom of his heart, he could definitely waited for 2/3years. During this period he would had improved his status and could persuade Priyanka to be economically independent. But he was not confident that can change his status and if so, Priyanka may change her mind. He was also not sure about his love.(Look what happening between Kreema & Shahid) Hence he never opted the option of buying time ,work hard and get the positive result .
Asad Bn Saif on October 9, 2007 1:57 pm
I endorse the view tht justice must prevail. The murky situation which was created due to corrupt high handed approach of the police and collusion with rich people to deprive a citizen of his legitimate rights to live with. The truth must brought out and culprits must be brought to book exemplarily.
Asad Bn Saif on October 9, 2007 2:00 pm
I endorse the view expressed in column that justice must prevail and culprits whoever they are must be broght to book exemplarily.
Ashish Sanyal on October 9, 2007 4:11 pm
Guilty will now be arrested thanks to the public outcry in Kolkata.But is Priyanka SAFE in her fathers house? Will she tell the trust?
Protection should be provided to her.
If she tells a doctored story the case against the police and all those guilty will fall apart.You can be sure that she is being subjected to a great deal of emotional pressure by members of her family and their lawyers.They could push her to her death to save themselves.
A PIL should be filed to provide her a safe house under a witness protection program.(not sure if there a provision for this in our law)
So the Pessimistic Optimist on October 9, 2007 5:30 pm
It is our responsibility to prevent atrocities against ALL people. A man has been killed. His wife is left with his killers. The police have been corrupt. The murderers roam free. These are the basic issues. What kind of a man Rizwanur was, his religious background, why he married Priyanka, whether he should have amassed more wealth first, whether he gave her a happy married life, whether her parents’ anger/feelings of shame were justified, these are all secondary to the act of murder and the aiding and abetting of it. That people feel otherwise gives me great cause for concern about the state of our humanity and morality, which while linked to religion, is not exclusive to any particular kind. Despite this, I hope for justice.
Priyanka Gupta on October 9, 2007 6:01 pm
The incident is horrendous!!! It makes it clear that citizens are on their own and the protectors are the ones who loot us and consider themselves to be the moral policemen. At the end of the day I feel that if I pay my taxes, is it doing any good to me?? When the government talks of tolerence (for votes, of course), it should (ideally!!!) look into sensitising its own folks over the same… We have a long way to go and I strongly believe that its high time that we police ourselves and LEAD INDIA!!!
Rajib Banerjee on October 9, 2007 6:33 pm
Hi, to surmise the points of concern:

1) Is this a free nation, where the will of law reigns supreme?

2) R we free people, free enough to excercise our own views and practices? Free to dream..

3) Is not religion an extremely personal part of my being and am I not free to practice it, without inviting censure?

4) Who am I? Am I because of how much I have in my bank OR Is my worth judged by what I do?

5) Why does after 60 years of freedom, people like Rahul, Pat, Vishwanth, continue to express such views?
Viswanath on October 9, 2007 8:22 pm
Well said rajib, and thanks for your advice.
Riswan is now dead and we should pray for his soul and hope the culprits will be arrested.

But one last question sir, Why you the incarnations of civilization and progressiveness still attach your cast/creed together with your name you shit BANERJEE.
mita agrawal on October 10, 2007 1:14 am
well problem is Muslims keep their women under burkha (veil) and lured to other’s women.from now Hindu guys should ready to fight.by doing their women, what they are doing with our women.there should be balance in every thing. ashok todi should send his son to love and take away the sister of that man instead of killing him. By that he could suffer in live. Hindu family does not accept a Muslim girl but Muslim accepts it so easily only to increase their number for conversion and multiple marriage is permissible in their culture. there should be one Hindu girl- Muslim boy marriage for two Muslim girl- Hindu boy marriage.by that neither there will be any media attention nor communal tension. did you forget news of Muslim guy getting 5000 $ for converting each girl in british universities and british cops cracked down kept these things under control . Is british government also communal? we hindu guys have to do such things for saving our mother, sister and daughter. where is media when forceful marriage are being carried out in pakistan and bangladesh. it would occured here also if there would no event like gujurat and mumbai riot.is it morally right to marry a woman of 10years younger than man age .Rizwan was appointed as teacher of that girl not as lover.He played with the faith of the girl’s parent.He got the right punishment. Priyanka go and marry a suitable hindu guy. and forget everything.It is uncertain that Priyanka’s parents don’t like her husband but they like her very much.she will be safe with them.
rajesh on October 10, 2007 1:18 am
well problem is Muslims keep their women under burkha (veil) and lured to otherâ€™s women.from now Hindu guys should ready to fight.by doing their women, what they are doing with our women.there should be balance in every thing. ashok todi should send his son to love and take away the sister of that man instead of killing him. By that he could suffer in live. Hindu family does not accept a Muslim girl but Muslim accepts it so easily only to increase their number for conversion and multiple marriage is permissible in their culture. there should be one Hindu girl- Muslim boy marriage for two Muslim girl- Hindu boy marriage.by that neither there will be any media attention nor communal tension. did you forget news of Muslim guy getting 5000 $ for converting each girl in british universities and british cops cracked down kept these things under control . Is british government also communal? we hindu guys have to do such things for saving our mother, sister and daughter. where is media when forceful marriage are being carried out in pakistan and bangladesh. it would occured here also if there would no event like gujurat and mumbai riot.is it morally right to marry a woman of 10years younger than man age .Rizwan was appointed as teacher of that girl not as lover.He played with the faith of the girlâ€™s parent.He got the right punishment. Priyanka go and marry a suitable hindu guy. and forget everything.It is uncertain that Priyankaâ€™s parents donâ€™t like her husband but they like her very much.she will be safe with them.
hs on October 10, 2007 1:19 am
yes rajesh u r right… hindu will understand it but in mass.
gopal on October 10, 2007 3:30 am
If muslim community shouting so loud for a simple cause of sonia mirza’s miniskirt. why hindu cant? rajesh u r right.
badri on October 10, 2007 3:47 am
Rahul,
You are a useless piece of shit. Nobody asked your opinion. I think if I had a daughter I would marry her to a decent muslim man like Rizwanur than a hindu pig like you. I am hindu by the way. If you want to do any service to your country then dont post anymore comments.

badri.
vivek on October 10, 2007 9:12 am
let me share some information with you all.
When Muslim came to India in 10th or 11th century their strength was only 40 (or max. could be 400) Today their combined strength(In+Pak+Bang) is around 40 crores.
When India got independence Muslim population in India was about 11% . Today its around 16% and unofficially it’s around 22%.
How did it happen?

We Hindus are the most secular in the world and that’s why we are tolerating all such nuisance.Look what had happen in Hyderabad yesterday. A vice principal were shown the doors. What was his fault? He just scolded two Muslim students for late coming. The entire Muslim cluster joined within no time to protest. Result. By 10.30 Am VP was shown the doors.With this incidence it appears Teacher has no respect when it come caste and creed. Whereas in Hindu’s way of teaching,first it’s parents then teacher and rest other things
Is this the state of affairs acceptable to us. Do we ever protest for such incidence?

Last year around this time, in Pakistan 3 Hindus girls(aging 12,16,19) of the same family were kidnapped and when the father filed a FIR with Police with great difficulties , he got a reply from near by Madrasa that these girls had converted into Muslim and now it is difficult for them live with their parents due to cultural difference, they will remain under their custody.(This was reported in TOI main Headlines in International section). Finally, they were allowed to meet for 5 mins under strict supervision and in Burka. It was reported that their eyes were red as nothing else was visible in Burka. Is not this more shocking? Did any one bother? I still feel pains about such incidence and my eyes are still wet.Such living examples are endless.
arjun on October 10, 2007 12:35 pm
shame on u muslim baiters ……u so called pseudo seculairists……….what angers me most in this case is how these so called intellectuals of our society have come out in open protesting the killing( thts wht they say…..who knows maybe the dude went and commited sucide)……where were these bastards when countless hindus where killed ….there houses looted…… women raped..in a despicable country called bangladesh…..they never came out and protested…..never raised their voice………..here in united states in california a few months back we had a case whre a muslim guy from bangladesh killed a family cuz the girls family being hindu were not in favor of there daughter dating a muslim……..there was no protests or apologies from the muslim community here………..only in a country called india u will find these spineless individuals these pseudo despondent secularists
harsha on October 10, 2007 1:35 pm
thanks media for keeping mind of hindu burning.one day it will burst.still in western society also Christian- Muslim marriage unfavorable one . why we are so much liberal. there should be balance in everything. rajesh u r right.if muslim organization entering to such case why not Hindu organization like RSS and viswahinduparisad.
PK on October 10, 2007 3:18 pm
We’re getting sick about this issue which is hogging the limelight beyond its due. It seems the issue as if has become a lifeline for the print media and T.V. for their survival.

It is quite amazing to note that the major events like Bombay Blast and burning of train at Godhra and their magnitude have never seemed to have evoked a single protest in this city. While people are bent out here to make a mountain out of a mole and it is evident they have no better issue to deal with than this one.

We sincerely feel sorry for what has happened to the victim and his family while we feel even more sad for those innocent lives lost because of the madness of Jehaddis.
Rajan on October 10, 2007 3:48 pm
Don’t you see it’s a live test case of clashes of civilizations. As America and Iraq are not compatible, similarly how a rich and high society vegetarian Marwari girl could be compatible to a lowly bred beef eating Muslim ? Let us not dream of an egalitarian society where Maharaja of Jodhpur GUJ SINGH marrying Mamta Bannerjee on the other hand Pricess from Scindia family marrying Subhash Chakrabarty. It only happens in films like Coolie and not in real life. If at all happens then I shudder to think of consequences. Let us not fool ourselves, let us not be a day dreamer all the time.
Guddu on October 10, 2007 4:02 pm
We have reacted enough to this issue. However I would like to have responses from my friends with hands on their hearts, will Yaqub, Saquib Firoz, Adil, Ahmed and Rafique happily agree to place their sisters and daughters hands to financially backward Hindu Boys ?

If you are honest to your heart please respond to this accordingly.
Withheld on October 10, 2007 9:01 pm
I am a religious hindu girl and would like to start by saying that Rahul has full liberty of expression . Having said that, there are a few things I want to point out to him .
I have been a classmate of Rizwan for 3 years and though I never knew him well, anyone could see that he was an excellent student, dedicated and meticulous . Coming from a poor family, he could have been a ‘broker’ of human trafficking and earned a lot of money at a young age . Instead, he chose to study hard and get a decent job and support his family . Does that not tell you anything about a person, Rahul ? It has been splashed all over the media that he was a dedicated, helpful teacher to his students apart from being an excellent student himself . Why did you so conveniently overlook these facts and decide to malign an innocent man who is dead due to no fault of his ?Have you never heard of Hindu men who beat up or burn their wives for dowry . I think a strata of society, be it hindu or muslim or any religion, is evil . I also agree that it is difficult for a rich enterpreneur to see his daughter live the life of hardship after all he has done for her . Even if we assume, that their love affair was wrong, then Priyanka was also an equally guilty party. Mr. Todi, kill your own daughter next time rather than someone else’s son …she is equally to blame . Priyanka will get over the trauma and lead a normal life one day…but will Rizwan ever come back ? And Rahul, look into the eyes of the grief stricken mother, who has not only lost her son ut also her means of sustenance . I don’t know if you are Hindu or Muslim, but are you a man ? If you are, then prove it by offering an apology …otherwise you will forever be known as the ‘eunuch’ of society .I believe that Rizwan was offered a blank checque which he never encashed . I believe you would have , in his place taken the money and run instead of trying to get back your lawfully wedded wife ! Shame on you !
Soman on October 10, 2007 11:53 pm
No need to apologize Rahul. You can disdain the hostile reactions of pseudo secularists with deserving contempt.
harsha on October 11, 2007 12:36 am
rahul is right.
di on October 11, 2007 12:37 am
i m supporting rahul and rajesh also
Withheld on October 11, 2007 1:47 am
hey, did you guys know that rahul is rahul todi? so much becomes clear now…..woudn’t be surprised if harsh,soman,rajesh and di are from the same gharana…if not the same person
Pat on October 11, 2007 3:13 am
To Withheld the so called hindu girl

|| I have been a classmate of Rizwan for 3 years and though I never knew him well,

|| It has been splashed all over the media that he was a dedicated, helpful teacher to his students apart from being an excellent student himself . Why did you so conveniently overlook these facts and decide to malign an innocent man who is dead due to no fault of his ?

First of all you say you do not know the guy really well. Then you believe in what the media has propogated and then you come to the conclusion that he was innocent. How come you know all this as you did not know the guy really well?

|| Have you never heard of Hindu men who beat up or burn their wives for dowry .

Yes I have heard a lot of such incidents and in my opinion such men should be hanged naked in public so that everyone knows the consequences of such acts.

||Even if we assume, that their love affair was wrong, then Priyanka was also an equally guilty party. Mr. Todi, kill your own daughter next time rather than someone elseâ€™s son â€¦she is equally to blame . Priyanka will get over the trauma and lead a normal life one dayâ€¦but will Rizwan ever come back ?

I think Rizwan had a very good idea of what he is getting into. He Should have known what could happen and even knowing this he went ahead with his plans. He did not care about himself or the girl or his own family. Why do you or anyone else care for him and make such a big outcry?

|| I donâ€™t know if you are Hindu or Muslim, but are you a man ? If you are, then prove it by offering an apology â€¦otherwise you will forever be known as the â€˜eunuchâ€™ of society.

I have lived in India and outside and I used to have secular ideas when I was in India as many such people in this list. But after living outside of India you realize that people like rizwan could have evil intensions. And all your crap about educated and good student and stuff does not hold water.

I have seen so many educated muslim fanatics who are willing to give their own life to kill inocent people. You don’t have to go out of India to prove this point. In most of the recent bomb blasts who are the accused people? Its not poor and backward people its the educated muslims. They are engineers and doctors and even then they sew up such acts. Can you please give me a good reason for such behaviour?
Shahrukh Khan on October 11, 2007 4:48 am
LETS TOUCH THE BASE:- In India people who are old, uneducated, criminal are qualified enough to be Chief Minister or Ministers or Politician and run the state with the help of Bureaucrats and IPS who are also not much qualified who the post except few.
Politician are more involved in creating sources of revenue for himself through these channels of Bureaucrats and IPS and Criminals. CM of West Bengal seems to be more involved in building relationship with the industrialists and capitalist rather than the common man. IPS officers who are involved in the case Ajoy Kumar and Gyanwant Singh have least knowledge to benefit and service common man rather than have more tricks to earn revenue for himself and the government. The Commissioner of Police of Kolkata has more time for Cricket Association of Bengal(CAB), simply because its a good and high source of revenue.
Where are all these revenue going? Poor Common Man and Middle Class people are struggling every single day throughout the life to keep himself ALIVE. People are sleeping on the road without foods. People have no jobs. no food, no home except Indian Citizenship and Voting right. All Indian people should boycott this Electoral systems and elect qualified educated young people without criminal records and elect those people who have at least 5 years of experience in social and charitable service .All good human being should try their luck for IAS and IPS examinations. ALL EDUCATED PEOPLE SHOULD INFLUENCE THE UNEDUCATED COMMON MAN ABOUT THE RIGHT AND WRONG.
I can guarantee you all that in 10 to 20 years YOUNG INDIA will be with YOUNG MINISTERS TO RUN THE COUNTRY AND STATES. THE TECHNOCRATS TO MANAGE POLICE AND BUREAUCRATS. IN THIS WAY INDIA WILL BE A SUPER POWER.
Dr.Rajiv Gupta on October 11, 2007 5:09 am
Shahrukh, you are right. Indian were ruled by Mugal and there were famous Slave Dynasty. and thereafter ruled by English and then by the Corrupted Politician and Ministers. We should wake from the sleep. We should come together to remove this corrupted systems right now and today itself so that our next generations benefits and live in good and congenial systems.
Every minute we spend…… we should fight to improve the current systems.
Rajib Banerjee on October 11, 2007 10:14 am
The biggest negative, bigger than Rizwanur’ death, is the finding that even after 60 years of Indian Independence, really CREEPY CRAWLIES like RAHUL, DI, RAJESH, SOMAN, GUDDU, VIVEK, GOPAL, MITA & RAJAN are coming out of the rotten woodwork.

AND these are the HYPOCRITES who speak of the Taliban, of Jehadis, of innocent Bangladeshi Hindus, of a Huntingtonian “Clash of Civilisations”.

They and their ilk, are the actual avatars of the TALIBAN; as fundamentalists have no religion other than Inhumanity.

And Vishwanath, I am Rajib Banerjee, the surname inherited from my ancestors, my surname in no way inhibiting me to be an Indian citizen; I try to practice what the makers of modern India like Swami Vivekananda, Ramkrishna Paramhansa, Raja Rammohan Roy, Gandhi and Tagore had dreamt of….

CRY My India, CRY today, for when your children die, others rejoice because He was not of their creed…..
SAHNI on October 11, 2007 1:03 pm
I don’t think any one among the respondents have taken any sort of vicarious delight in the death of the guy. That is not the issue.
But the larger issue is the misplaced magnanimity and sentiment of typical individuals like Rajib Banerjee and his cohorts show some uncanny behaviour pattern who would cry hoarse if America bombards Islamabad but would prefer to keep mum when Pakistan strikes India, there they would scramble for reasons like Kashmir issue and all humbug. During Indo - China war it was people like Rajib sounded discordant note proclaiming that it was India who attacked China and not otherwise.

Rajib, people like you who have self certified themselves as enlightened ones might conveniently eat Beef and won’t find it a sacrilege while no muslim worth his salt would touch Pork / HAM. And therefore Ashoke Todi would not like to accept in his wildest dream to be alive to see his so loving daughter Priyanka Todi to be known after the marriage as Sabina Khatun…..You may go ahead and allow your daughter or sister marry a Muslim guy and stay in the ghetto called Samshul Huda Road. But this cannot be the cup of tea for all.

We are against the murder of the guy and issue should veer around this point alone and not about the marriage which was just not compatible.

Children should be allowed to be given liberty to have their ways in conformity to the norms of the society and once they attain maturity must exercise restrain while taking any crucial decision in life thinking over the consequences as well. Children have every right to be happy in their life but they have no right to unsettle their parents and make them unhappy. And therefore they must have some restrain. On the other hand they ought not to have the license to bring stigma and disgrace to the family for their self satiation call it whatever you feel like love or lust.

Please do not mix up issues here. Please fight for more justified causes like Ration Shop Owners in your neighbourhood are hoarding the stock and depriving poor from distribution of their legitimate right.
samira ahmed on October 11, 2007 2:13 pm
people like rahul should not be given any attention.their opinion doesn’t deserve a place in media.my sympathy is with priyanka and rizwan.rizwan’s killer should be punished and priyanka should be allowed to lead her life as she would wish.god bless priyanka.
Rajib Banerjee on October 11, 2007 6:19 pm
Hsving said all, Mr Sahni, let me point it out to you that my ancestors are originally from Bangladesh, who migrated to India, during the carnage of partition. We lost out then and again we lost close family members who had stayed behind in then East Pakistan, during the next big migration of people to India, i.e. during the Bangladesh Liberation War.

Further, I dont know how much you have seen the horrors of war but peripherally at least, I have seen my father go to war during the liberation of Bangladesh. He had closely worked with Sheikh Mujibar Rahman, who was treacherously assassinated at a later date.

My uncle was a prisoner of war, in the 1962 conflict with China and was untraceable to the family for a period of more than 6 months.

Therefore I dont need any lessons in patriotism from arm-chair right-wingers like you.

I lost relatives to fanatics in Bangladesh, BUT I HARBOR no ill will to my countrymen of the same faith. For I known that poverty and illiteracy, drive people mad.

What I dont know and would like very much to understand, is why apparently educated people like you turn fundamentalist inspite of our common cultural upbringing of Swami Vivekananda, Tagore or Gandhi?

Feel free to express your thoughts, for only in discussion are cultural misconceptions and prejudices removed.

CRY my country, CRY, for when your children die, people ask of what faith was He?
Soman on October 11, 2007 11:58 pm
Rajib Vanarji,
You are just a kid and knows nothing. At least try to read news paper every day.
Pat on October 12, 2007 1:56 am
To Mr. Ranjib Banerjee or Vanarjee whatever and whoever you are.

I salute your father, uncle who suffered in war. But I do not salute you as you are letting them down. In the war, they might have also killed someone’s son, husband, father, brother. But that was war and they were defending their countrymen. If you agree or not it does not matter, but there is an internal war going on too.

People like you will wait for the minority community to reach a certain percent and then when they ask for freedom, you guys will divide the country in the name of religion and give it away for peace. It has happened in the past and I do not believe the minority community because it will surely happen in the future. You should be blind not to see the pattern. Look at Kashmir. Look at Assam. Pakistan and India were created on basis of religion and we should be making sure that there is no further division on basis of religion.

All those minority community who call themselves Indian and secular are NOT. Why don’t they accept hindu girls with their names after marriage. Why do they try to convert them after marriage. If they are secular enough they should be flexible. I see in 95% of cases, the girl’s name is changed after marriage. You can say that its just the name that has changed. You can also say that they have to change the name for nikah. Get married in a court then. But it shows the mentality of the person. Why don’t they accept common penal code? Why do they have the right to keep 4 wives?

Do you come out in open for the cause of common penal code? Do you raise your voice against such hypocracy in the system which itself promotes division? You hide your face in such matters.

Please answer these question to yourself rather then venting out your frustration on me. You should not kill a person because he is from the minority community but its your right to be careful of such people and as I pointed out in 95% of cases these people are not secular and hence dangerous. If you see a snake you take evasive action eventhough some snakes are not poisonous. Can you tell me why you do that? Its human nature to be selfish and protect himself first. You don’t have to kill the snake but then you have to be carefull that it does not bite you.

This in no way justifies the killing of Rizwan. This is a much larger issue and a social and psychological as well.
Dr.Rajiv Gupta on October 12, 2007 1:57 am
If Rizwanur Rahman had been an IAS/IPS officers/Minister/ or son of a rich Muslim Billionaire like Azim Premji, will Todi dare to kill Rizwanur or else beg Rizwanur to marry his daughter.
Its not about religion its about POWER OF STATUS AND MONEY.
Pat on October 12, 2007 2:14 am
Dr. Rajiv Gupta,
More than POWER OF STATUS AND MONEY, I think its the SYSTEM and BUREAUCRACY of our country and on top of everything its WE AS CITIZENS OF OUR COUNTRY who let such system and bureaucracy survive.
S. S. Kere on October 12, 2007 5:35 am
The death of Rizwanur Rahman certainly looks suspicious. Marriage between two consenting adults is not against the law. Famous families such as the Nehrus and others have been marrying across religions or castes for a long time. Examples: Indira and Feroze Gandhi, a Parsi. Her son, Rajiv married an Italian Catholic, Sonia, now the President of Congress. What is the big deal? A long time ago, We have the example of Akbar the Great.

The death of Rahman by all indications looks like murder most foul. The people and the press must not rest until it is thoroughly investigated and the guilty party severely punished.
S.KHAN on October 12, 2007 5:48 am
MISCONCEPTION ABOUT ISLAM

Rizwanur was born in a muslim family and Priyanka was born in a hindu family. Did they have taken permission from their God to be born in their respective family. Everybody has a choice to select their schools, colleges, education,career, spouse, and religion. No one has right to be barrier in their way of life. I was born in a muslim family and I believe that I know Hinduism more than any other common hindu. Does any hindu ever read and understand their own holy books. Read the Gita ,the Bible and then the Quran, you will find the lot of similarity in each holy book, but Quran is the latest version of all. Hinduism was born in 4000 -5000 years ago, Jewishism was born in 4000-3000 years ago, Buddhism was born in 3000-2000 years ago,Christianity was born in 2000 years ago, Islam was born 1400 years ago. All religion was represented by their respective Prophets who came in different countries to spread PEACE and ASK ALL HUMAN TO REMEMBER AND PRAY GOD. People tend to practice religion what their parents do but never give a thought whether its right or wrong. You have a choice to do research about Islam, Christianity, Hinduism, Jainism, Buddhism, Jewish,etc and then believe what you love to believe. In all cases your surrender and bow your head to ONE SUPREME LORD.
Pat on October 12, 2007 6:19 am
S. Khan,
I agree that no one was born selecting a religion. You are right when you say you have to select what is right and what is wrong once one gets mature. But still people tend to stick to the religion and religious beliefs they were born with. Or else how will you justify someone adhering to religious beliefs/laws such as converting one’s name after marriage? Or people trying to divide a religion on caste basis?

About MISCONCEPTION OF ISLAM, the main culprits of such misconception are fanatic muslims themselves who think everything is jihad.
Rajib Banerjee on October 12, 2007 10:30 am
Mr Pat, I dont know who you are or exactly what you are, but, a student of history you are not.

My country, Sir, was never was born on the basis of religion, our founding fathers had dreamt of it as a haven for all faith.

It was Pakistan which was built on the promise of religion, BUT millions of Muslims had stayed back in this land, believing the ethos of a secular republic.

When people like you and other close minded right-wing CREEPY CRAWLIES shout from roof-tops, you only make Pakistanis happier, for only then are the founding principles of Pakistan justified.

And Little men like you do not deserve frustration, people like you generate only Pity.

Grow up, Sir, shed your prejudices, embrace others whatever their faith, earn their trust by your actions ; kill the snakes that hiss in your heart; Common civil code and other such issues which are the just requirements of a civil society, will automatically fall in place.

Shame my countrymen, Hang your heads in Shame, for when your comrades die, people ask what was their name…
SAHNI on October 12, 2007 1:05 pm
I give two hoots to what people have expressed in favour or against the relationship of Rizwanur & Priyanka. My heart bleeds for the mother who lost her son for his own misdemeanour. Rizwanur was a teacher and he was matured enough to know his bearing and therefore he had no business to meddle with a girl with such high profile background. If it was not him had it been some Rakesh from similar background would have met the same fate.

Let us not break our head and rake the dust for nothing let law take its own course.

Even if Ashoke Todi is found to be guilty at the end eventhen he deserve only 50% of the punishment while the other half should be left for Rizwanur who was equally guilty to this crime.
Rajib Banerjee on October 12, 2007 6:48 pm
Mr Sahni, right thinking Indian citizens dont give a damn to your sermonising, too.

For with the medieval feudal mentality that you have, and a regular pocket-book sized right-wing fascist that you are, you and the other CRAZIES in your mould still view people on the basis of religion and bank balances….

What profile you moron? It is enough that Rizwanur was an educated Indian and that’s that.

And your attempts at making Rizwanur guilty for his death, reminds us of the story about the wolf and the lamb, from Aesop’s fables.. The wolf making the lamb guilty for the water he had not mudied…, rings a bell?

CRY my beloved nation, CRY, for when your children die, some ask how much bank balance he had, of what profile was he…..
Bonbibi on October 12, 2007 11:08 pm
Thanks for putting those creepy crawlies back in their place Rajib Banerjee - and yes, lets keep Bengal’s flame for celebrating difference and giving birth to Tagore, Nazrul, Ramkrishnadeb, Lalon, Chaitanya alive and burning. We want a Bengal where anyone is free to love and marry anyone they want, a Bengal where people are allowed to practice the religion they want, a Bengal where the poor and the ‘non-mainstream’ have both a place and a voice..
I keep praying, in Tagore’s words, ‘into that heaven of freedom my father, let my country awake’..
Sify on October 12, 2007 11:32 pm
Rizwanur died as he was hit by train: CID
Wednesday, 10 October , 2007, 21:58
Kolkata: A senior CID official of West Bengal on Wednesday claimed computer graphics teacher Rizwanur Rehman, whose marriage with the daughter of a Hindu industrialist earned the wrath of some senior Kolkata police officials, died as he was hit by a train.

Inspector general (special) of CID P Neeraj Narayan, who is handling the case, said the possibility of Rizwanur being pushed before a train was remote. Rehman’s body was found beside train tracks in Dum Dum in Kolkata on September 24.

“It was daytime and there were many people around then. Moreover, passengers of the train would have noticed,” he said.

Quoting the postmortem report, Narayan said Rizwanur had an injury in the back of the head. “There are many cases where persons dying in train accidents have a single injury mark.”

The area near Dum Dum where the body was found was an accident prone zone where 182 persons were run over and killed by trains this year while last year there were 220 cases, Narayan said.

The main problem was to determine whether Rizwanur deliberately came in front of a train or it was an accident, he said.

“What is, however, certain is that he died because he was hit by a train,” said Narayan.

CID sources said the nature of Rizwanur’s injuries suggested that he had been hit by a train’s buffer or some front part which caused his death.
Rizwanur's wife on October 12, 2007 11:39 pm
My husband committed suicide: Rizwanur’s wife

Enlarge Photo
By IBNlive.com
Wednesday October 10, 04:59 PM
New Delhi: For the first time since Kolkata graphic artist Rizwanur Rehman’s death, his wife Priyanka Todi broke her silence before members of the West Bengal Women’s Commission, who visited her on Tuesday, and reportedly said that her husband had committed suicide.

Priyanka is believed to have told the team that she sought an impartial probe into her husbandâ€™s death.

Rejecting claims that police in any way had pressurised her to leave Rizwanur, Priyanka said that she had not been forcibly taken away from her husband.

The nine-member team, led by Commission Chairperson Professor Jasodhara Bagchi, met Priyanka at her Salt Lake residence in Kolkata.

The statement comes as a relief to the police and Priyanka’s father, businessman Ashok Todi.

Meanwhile, Kolkata Police Commissioner Prasun Mukherjee, who has been pushed into a tight corner in the Rizwanur case, met CBI director Vijay Shanker in New Delhi on Tuesday, even as Calcutta High Court heard a petition from Rizwanurâ€™s family seeking a CBI investigation into his mysterious death.

Even the Left Front is demanding a CBI probe and CPM patriarch Jyoti Basu has made his partyâ€™s stand clear by seeking action against the accused police officers, including Mukherjee.

It is known that Rizwanur spent some time in Bagbazar, Cossipore and Dum Dum Chiriamore on September 21 â€” the day his body was found on the tracks near Patipukur, Kolkata. Investigators have tracked his movements from cell phone records but are not sure why he went to these places.

The marriage witness and student of Rizwanur, Sadique Hossain told CNN-IBN that he had received several threats from the Kolkata Police after he played the witness to Rizwanur and Priyankaâ€™s marriage.

â€œPolice officials threatened me on phone. They also asked me to come to headquarters,â€ he recalls.

Despite witnesses like Hossain coming forward to corroborate accusations of police involvement in the death, the case in the Calcutta High Court continues to drag on at a snail’s pace.

Meanwhile, the possibility of a CBI inquiry into the case is also dwindling. The state government has pleaded in court that the complaint filed by Rizwan’s family alleges no a cognizable offence.

â€œUntil and unless there is a cognizable offence, CBI cannot intervene,â€ said Advocate General (West Bengal), Balai Ray.
Pat on October 13, 2007 12:31 am
Mr. Rajib,
WOW. what an essay on ethics and moral. You deserve a NOBEL PEACE prize for it. Dod you really think that these people believe in such ethics?

You are insulting Lt Kanavdeep Singh, Lt Dheerendra Singh Atri, Captain Sajjan Singh Malik, Major James Thomas, Major Manish Hiraji Pitambare, Captain Vishal Bhandral, Lt Natarajan Parthiban, Captain R Harshan, Majors K P Vinay and Dinesh Raghuraman and many others who laid down their life fighting militants and terrorists in Kashmir. Most of the militants and terrorist they were fighting against were not PAKIS. On further analysis they were not all poor, illiterate or socially backward. They were ALL muslims. Does’nt that say enough? Can you please give me a reason why thats the case? The emphasis on ALL. The whole world is realizing this fact why do some ignorant fools like you choose to close your eyes?

EMBRACE OTHERS WHATEVER THEIR FAITH only to be stabbed in the back. Having lived outside of India for so many years, I can truely relate my sayings. I have seen so called Indian muslims engaging with their bretheren from all over the world and taking pride in joining muslim associations. But when it come to indian associations, they are alien to them ans show no concern. This is not just one isolated case. I have seen this many a times with many individuals. For them, religion comes first and country afterwards. The sooner you understand this fact the better.

Their might be nothing wrong with the relkigion but there is surely something wrong with what is being propogated to the followers.
Hamza on October 13, 2007 3:08 am
it really sad.. this argument here.. calling names is really not going to solve anything.. i have no interest in joining this “religious” debate as its pointless.. everyone`s just gonna be stubborn.. but the fact is an innocent has died here.. and “that” is the issue..
whether a Hindu, a Muslim, a Christian, a Sikh, a Buddhist, an atheist, or whoever else is killed, its still another human victim.. if candlelight vigils have not been organized for any of the other mentioned murders, its because you guys never had the balls to come out and organize it.. for the record.. there are as many Hindus as Muslims participating in the vigil.. and its being organized by and on the doorstep of a Catholic institute.. so instead of sitting back at home and crying “why not” how about coming forward and following the example..

get real people.. the loss of a human life is sad whether it happens in Calcutta, Dhaka, Godhra, Burma, Iraq or the United States…

the word empathy seems have disappeared from most of your dictionaries…

ps - all you “Indians”.. here`s something which the real Indians, the one`s who did something about being an Indian… who sacrificed all so that we could be privileged of ruining their ideals once gave us…
———————–
WE, THE PEOPLE OF INDIA, having solemnly resolved to constitute India into a SOVEREIGN SOCIALIST “SECULAR” DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC and to secure to all its citizens:

JUSTICE, social, economic and political;
LIBERTY of thought, expression, belief, faith and worship;
EQUALITY of status and of opportunity;
and to promote among them all
FRATERNITY assuring the dignity of the individual and the unity and integrity of the Nation;

IN OUR CONSTITUENT ASSEMBLY this twenty-sixth day of November, 1949, do HEREBY ADOPT, ENACT AND GIVE TO OURSELVES THIS CONSTITUTION.

———————————

and here`s a few facts you guys might enjoy pondering over..

- Jinnah was not a muslim.. he changed his name so that his political position would improve, otherwise he would have lost to the dynamism of indian leaders like Gandhi, Nehru, Patel, and others.. so Pakistan was not really an “Muslim” idea..

- There were more muslims who chose to remain in India than move to Pakistan or Bangladesh.. my own family severed all ties with any friends or relatives who chose to leave.. and i know many other such families..

- Islam does teach God above all, and i don’t see what is the issue in that, because among other things a good Muslim means being a good and loyal citizen as well.. all faiths are meant to be respected..

get real and wake up peopl.. stop being putty for political propaganda.. you`ll just restrict your development.. the fact that so many have decided to join a debate itself reflects that there has been at least a minimum amount of reflection done..

i agree having a loved one elope with someone is a bitter pill to swallow for any human being.. be it on the basis of religion or financial standing..

but to have so little respect for human life is a shame…

ps - as the issue if godhra train burning was brought up a few times, i suggest taking the effort to get your hands on the documentry movie shot by Rakesh Sharma(a hindu) - final solution..

i repeat my request.. stop being putty for political propaganda…

ps2 - sad as it is. there are many so called islamic terrorist factions. as are hindu terror groups.. and irish.. and christian.. and neo nazis… do the killings of the Australian missionaries by the hands of a few hindus make them all murderers… Shall we take the Ku Klux Klan to be the essence of Christianity and condemn all christians for the absolutely unchristian acts of a few misguided “goondas”.. to take make examples out of exceptions is almost as big a crime as to commit the crime itself…

pointing fingers is easy… but it doesnt get a solution.. Wake up and smell the coffee.. if there is something which has happened to someone which you feel needs to be protested about, then get up and protest for god`s sake.. we`ll never see a better world if we sit down and just play the blame game.. you`ll find solutions only if you look for them.. so stop whining about whats wrong with the world and try and change it… or do you want your kid to grow up in an environment of such hate and distrust ?? of such fickle human values??? i mean what`ll we tell the generations yet to come??? cut him/burn him cause he belongs to another faith.. another creed ?? does any of your respective religions teach that.. ???

its a sad day for humanity that for man there is so little care for others pain.. would your mothers cry different tears than rizwanur`s, had you faced the same fate??

take care people… i`m not as accomplished a writer as most of you and understand that what i`ve written might be too fragmented and disconnected, one point from the other.. but i do feel that we are at a verge of a global revolution.. or a civil war which will engulf us all in its misery…

the choices are ours to make.. so please, i pray choose wisely…
hemjith on October 13, 2007 3:06 pm
In this case it may be the industrialists gang who have murdered Rizwanur Rahman. How can we say that it is police. Polce might have done rest of the job to make this Drama perfect. Money is a real power in India, with money people manupulate everything. It is open secret that politicians, whether it is left, middle or right join hands with rich people and try to make our democracy a mockery.
arjun on October 13, 2007 6:00 pm
one muslim dies ( sucide or homicide who the f*** knows) and we have so much hoophala…….hundereds of hindu’s were killed in the neibhouring country………there was no reaction…………shame on u F***** bastards ………..calcutta is holding rallies candle light vigils………what a f***in bunch of spineless bastards u are u calcuttan secularists……….u f***in muslim baiters……u dont even know wht being secular means…………if u were truly secular u would hold those same candle light vigils and rallies when innocent people next door were being looted raped killed……but no u wanna show to the world your pseudo secularism hang ur heads in shame u calcuttan bastards……..F*** U ….F*** U….F*** U PSEUDO SECULAR BASTARDS
daisy on October 13, 2007 7:13 pm
secular means?????????????????????????????????? anti-hindu in india. It looks like that…….f*** u secular.
lavanya on October 13, 2007 7:21 pm
I really feel bad for Rizwanur Rahaman…………

Rahul u r a s*** of a person….God only knows how come u r born as a human……people like u create misunderstands in the community….i guess there is some fault in ur mental thinking….i can’t blame ur upbrining since it will be directed to ur parents….Do u think that getting married to a girl and accepting her as his wife and selling her can be done by only people like u and not like rizwanur rahaman…..
sume on October 13, 2007 7:23 pm
Arjun u r a f***ing a** how can u treat human being on basis of caste…….people like to should thrown in to bay of bengal…….u are the first f***ing a**…..
Hamza on October 13, 2007 9:30 pm
Dear Arjun,
thank you for bringing up such an intelligent arguments into the issue. I`d like to address each point which you have made..

“one muslim dies ( sucide or homicide who the f*** knows) and we have so much hoophalaâ€¦â€¦.hundereds of hinduâ€™s were killed in the neibhouring countryâ€¦â€¦â€¦there was no reactionâ€¦â€¦â€¦â€¦”

a) we are protesting about a murder which occurred in our own country, within the borders of our own society.. We don’t have the power to be noticed by outsiders or to change their rules and/or laws .. so although a vigil on humanitarian grounds would make sense it would be almost pointless, as it would not really change a damn thing..

b) where the hell were YOU and RAHUL and all the rest who have a problem with the vigil..? since you feel so strongly about the victims in other attacks, did YOU ever bother to come forward and protest?? Try it, and then judge the response… its so f***ing convenient to ask others to start a movement?? what about practicing what you preach ???? get out from behind the anonymity of the internet and make a show of protest the inhumanities which you feel others are facing.. you`ll be surprised with the response, and thats a guarantee…

“shame on u F***IN bastards â€¦â€¦â€¦.”

no sir.. shame on you…

“calcutta is holding rallies candle light vigilsâ€¦â€¦â€¦what a f***in bunch of spineless bastards u are u calcuttan secularistsâ€¦â€¦â€¦.u fu***in muslim baitersâ€¦â€¦u dont even know wht being secular meansâ€¦â€¦â€¦â€¦”

and pray do tell me what does secularism mean ???

“if u were truly secular u would hold those same candle light vigils and rallies when innocent people next door were being looted raped killedâ€¦â€¦but no u wanna show to the world your pseudo secularism hang ur heads in shame u calcuttan bastardsâ€¦â€¦..”

the candle light vigil is being held for the death of an innocent. it was initiated by people who cared for rizwanur, and supported by like minded individuls who have never met him and now unfortunately will never get the chance to… and what makes you say that these people will not protest the death or rape of a neigbour.. stop being retarded and start making sense… so much hate will only burn you up… get yourself a shrink.. it would make a nice book..

” …..”

the rest of your statements are simple reflection on the level of education which you have received, its sad to see that you vocabulary is so limited.. it mirrors the education imparted on you from you family and seriously its not something to be proud of… what are you so scared of ?? that your mommy and daddy are wrong when they taught you that Muslims are not humans ??? i could quote shakespeare here, but that would be pointless.. its not a part of narendra modi`s autobiography and your literature doubtfully crosses that…

anyways..
get real.. and try to stop hating…

regards and best wishes

Hamza

Ps - Eid Mubarak
ps2 - http://www.askoxford.com a good place for you to start.. maybe now you can move ahead from “f***”…
Pratheesh on October 14, 2007 12:35 am
The real tragedy is Mr.Rahul. The mindset,even animals dont have.
I wish to believe the comment posted in the name of “rahul” is a work of this media people who wish to stir things up and gain more publicity.

I would be more peacefull if I believe like that.

I wish so deeply.
Wolfgang Schulze on October 14, 2007 1:14 pm
IPS Officers’ list of Cal Police showing land & cellphones appear at http://www.wbgov.com/e-gov/English/IPS_List.pdf. The main suspects are at Sl. No. 19 & 141. Why don’t u all tell them a simple msg “We want death penalty for the supari killers of Rizwanur Rahman”?
Soman on October 14, 2007 2:29 pm
Rizwanur committed suicide. It is the truth and everybody knows it. So the title of this post stands absurd. So I request indiatime to delete this garbage .

what would you do if you see a cobra and a pseudo secularist(like rajib) simultaneously?
(clue :- if the cobra bites, The mortality rate is 5%. if it is the bite of a pseudo secularist you are guaranteed to die immediately)
daisy on October 14, 2007 2:33 pm
well problem is Muslims keep their women under burkha (veil) and lured to otherâ€™s women.from now Hindu guys should ready to fight.by doing their women, what they are doing with our women.there should be balance in every thing. ashok todi should send his son to love and take away the sister of that man instead of killing him. By that he could suffer in live. Hindu family does not accept a Muslim girl but Muslim accepts it so easily only to increase their number for conversion and multiple marriage is permissible in their culture. there should be one Hindu girl- Muslim boy marriage for two Muslim girl- Hindu boy marriage.by that neither there will be any media attention nor communal tension. did you forget news of Muslim guy getting 5000 $ for converting each girl in british universities and british cops cracked down kept these things under control . Is british government also communal? we hindu guys have to do such things for saving our mother, sister and daughter. where is media when forceful marriage are being carried out in pakistan and bangladesh. it would occured here also if there would no event like gujurat and mumbai riot.is it morally right to marry a woman of 10years younger than man age .Rizwan was appointed as teacher of that girl not as lover.He played with the faith of the girlâ€™s parent.He got the right punishment. Priyanka go and marry a suitable hindu guy. and forget everything.It is uncertain that Priyankaâ€™s parents donâ€™t like her husband but they like her very much.she will be safe with them.do some thing hindu………………..
zz on October 14, 2007 4:13 pm
The people responsible for killing Rizwanur Rahman should be publically tried and sentenced. Make this an example for other corrupt govt. servants. Let them think and realize that killing innocent people in INDIA will no longer be tolerated.
Realistic on October 14, 2007 9:20 pm
I think this blog ir run by Muslim mullas, who have posted in name of Hindu female names, in order to promote Muslim Male marry Hindu female so as to convert them.

All the other secularists, just think, if your sister or daughter is enticed in that religion, where women are treated like a sex object (Age-Six and up) and may soon have to share their husband with three others….
chromatin1 on October 15, 2007 7:59 am
The major problem is that the Todi family is rich and non-Bengali and media is trying to crucify the family. There is no evidence that they did anything wrong other than protecting their 23 year old daughter. Rahman was an womanizer and had some strange interest in rich Hindu girls like Priyanka Todi, Pompy Roy etc. He was not a hard working studious individual who was trying to advance himself like thousands of young men in Kolkata. He simply got involved with the wrong girl.
Abhijit---wtf??:|... on October 15, 2007 8:20 am
It’s feels uncomfortable to come across so many ignorantly blissful people..I sincerely hope people like Rahul,Daisy etc have an over active imagination or have been going through a bad acid trip.Anyway , I did realise the difference between Literacy and Education and I can only feel disgusted at the lack of latter.If they don’t belong to a fanatical religious group, I am sure they belong to a modern day monkey brigade.Who tells them that using brains is considered an intelligent thing to do?I am not sure why people aren’t talking about justice/corruption, instead of religion, here.The media doesn’t help too much in spreading the required awareness either..Am sure, god won’t be too happy with the way his creation has turned out to be…
raghab on October 15, 2007 8:45 am
u Muslim why u r posting here in the name of Hindu girls here? u can take name of ur mother ,sister and daughter’s name.
feroza on October 15, 2007 8:52 am
daisy is right.
fathima on October 15, 2007 8:57 am
our Muslim community should liberalize hindu guy- Muslim girl marriage also as they are for Hindu gal-Muslim boy marriage. grow up
Rajib Banerjee on October 15, 2007 9:51 am
Its’ sad that a boy’s untimely death has been turned on its head by all the rabid fundamentalists, who also preach about the dangers of Islamic fudamentalism, jehad and such - a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

These ignoramuses carp about Bangladeshi Hindus’ being killed, but do they come out and protest. No they stay in their comfy drawing rooms, poring over the Net and spewing venom from their hate-filled hearts on all and sundry.

They tar a community with a brush for the misdeeds of a few. Inane people who forget that for every Osama there is a Dr. A.P.J. Kalam, for every Nathuram Godse or Dara Singh there is a Dr. Amartya Sen or Dr. Rajendra Pachauri..

And cowards as they are, devoid of logical reasoning and inadequate vocabulary, these LOONIES hide behind three/four letter aliases and resort to the use of expletives to justify their poverty of thought…..

Rise my countrymen, Rise, for there is too much evil amongst us, to stay quiet and lie…
chintu on October 15, 2007 10:34 am
The case is unnecessary being given a colour of communalism. Let us consider the case in a simple manner. A lower middle class boy enamours and marries a rich girl with the dream of making it big (economically & socially) overnight. He has probably (I use probably because the case is not yet resolved) paid a heavy price for trying to take that big leap in life.

I do not think there should be such a hue & cry all over involving the case. It is possible only in Kolkata where idle brains are not in short supply.
Neila on October 15, 2007 12:15 pm
Have anyone seen the movie â€œThe escape from Talibanâ€ which is a real story (Kabuliwalar bowu) written by a Bengali lady from Kolkata. That story was a real and the writerâ€™s personal experience. She also fell in love with a Muslim guy (Afgani). After reaching her husbandâ€™s home and spending some days out there, she realized the reality
And came back to Kolkata, why ????? where is her love, dream â€¦..
So I think what has happened, happened for the best. Priyanka forget every thing, start your days ahead with great spirit , God is there for you to take care
Neila on October 15, 2007 12:32 pm
Taslima Nasreen a famous writer from Bangladesh is expelled from her home country by the religious supreme. Recently, insulted and beaten by a Muslim political leader at a press conference in Hydrabad. Can you imagine the mentality of that group?
How the secular mentality can explain such incidence? The writer is not a Hindu or any other . So all the Non Muslim girls, PLEASE CHECK YOUR MIND OR HEAD FIRST RATHER THAN YOUR HEART while you are in love with a Muslim guy.
kiran on October 15, 2007 12:52 pm
In islam, it is considered apostacy to shun islam and convert to any other religion. Rehman had agreed to convert to hinduism, just to save his marriage. It could be the handiwork of some fundamentalist mullahs also, please investigate this angle also.
Rajib Banerjee on October 15, 2007 4:56 pm
Someone had rightly pointed out that there exists a quantum gap between literacy and education, the number of posts from people like PAT, RAHUL, DI, RAJESH, SOMAN, GUDDU, VIVEK, GOPAL, MITA & RAJAN, DAISY all stand in proof.

One crackpot writes that ” So I think what has happened, happened for the best. Priyanka forget every thing, start your days ahead with great spirit , God is there for you to take care”.

Now, people are stooping that low, that there is no compunction in making Rizwanur responsible for his death and the worst, that his death is for the better. Better for whom Ma’am, for the Todis?

When the debate should veer to making the voice felt against rampant use of moneypower (TODIS), subverting the rule of law (Kolkata Police), remaining willing accomplice (the administration); the debate has turned into an all out hate attack against one community in particular.

Tell me Neila, is Indian Afghanistan? Then why are references to “Kabuliwalar bowu” being drawn?

Neither Taslima nor the LOONY TUNE from that fringe party in Hyderabad, represent the voice of Muslims.

All right thinking individuals of all communities, distrust such rhetoric which removes an individual’s right to free speech. A civil society is not made in this way.

Get yourself checked people, catch hold of a pscyhotherapist. Hate Mongers like you are a real threat to the ethos of India.

Do not denigrate my motherland in the eyes of the world. Your continued rabble, the verbal diahorrea, is causing real glee in the hearts of enemies of India, possibly Pakistan. Do not give flesh to the now dead TWO NATION THEORY.

India, inspite of you, will remain a secular republic. My country has withstood many evils, you are in a minority to cause her harm.
Dibendu on October 15, 2007 9:58 pm
I think people in this discussion has completely missed the basic point. First of all, the point that Muslims can only marry Hindu girls, only to then sell them off is ludicrous and the person who says this is out of his mind. Also the debate over whether the marriage was a plan by Rizwanur is not of importance. And the point whether it is because Rizwan was a Muslim that this news got such publicity is only true upto a point. The real reason behind this piece of news making headlines is the collusion between the police and the rich and powerful industrialist. The point is not whether priyanka was naive to marry at such a ‘tender’ age or whether this marriage would have stood the test of time. There are innumerable marriages that takes place without parents’ consent and lot many of them may end in failure. But this is a personal decision on the part of the individuals and the state has no authority to poke it’s nose in here. And when the lawmakers and lawkeepers gets into a dirty nexus with the rich and powerful - that is where the situation becomes revolting. This may not have been about inter-caste marriage at all. this may have been because Rizwanur could have been a 18 year old student, raising his voice after being denied of a seat in a college so that a minister’s son could get it. This simply points that the rich and powerful can get along with anything. Because they can buy off the law. And if that is the case, we, the people of India, will be left behind in the lurch. We should not let this happen. And thats why, instead of fighting over petty issues like whether Priyanka was right in marrying a muslim or whether Rizwan had other plans in mind, we should fight for this to save our rights and freedom.
Pat on October 15, 2007 10:00 pm
Mr. Rajib,
What a pathetic looser you are.

|| Tell me Neila, is Indian Afghanistan? Then why are references to â€œKabuliwalar bowuâ€ being drawn?

For you an Indian taken to Afghanistan and treated that way does not matter. You think it does not matter since it did not happen in India. If people like you still hold their pathetic mentality, such things will happen in India in near future.

This shows you logical reasoning. You tell us to go to a psychotherapist but you are the one who requires treatment. You have never answered any questions I have raised. You just keep on blabbering stuff which no longer holds water in todays’ world. I don’t have any comments for you anymore nor do I need to reply to you anymore because you are one stubborn ignorant fool who refuse to accept history nor want to learn anything from it.
Soman on October 15, 2007 11:55 pm
Rajib,
Who do you think you are, you coolie writer . You are the manifestation of ignorance so that you tried to misuse this place to publish your false biography. Your father fought the bangla war alone and won. Ok, you tell this story to the street kids that is immense on your streets. You can go on supporting jihadis but you can’t hide the truth with your putrid posts. All the abusive words you used stands reflexive.
fathima on October 16, 2007 3:02 am
muslim separated pakistan from india. now they want another part that is kasmir. tomorrow they may ask for another .they are not happy with anybody in this world. they cant live with anybody. they want to live alone in world.it may be true that all muslims are not terrorist but EVERY TERRORIST IN WORLD IS A CERTAINLY A MUSLIM. THINK TWICE BEFORE DEALING WITH A MUSLIM.Do u have idea how many fatwa are issued against muslim girl for keeping relation with hindu guy. WHEN HINDU FALLOW U IN A SIMILAR WAY U R CRYING NOW. hindu should grow up now……
dew on October 16, 2007 3:13 am
priyana todi said that her husband committed suicide then why so much noise here???? nothing is there suggesting homicide still in investigation. what do u want to prove??
Rajib Banerjee on October 16, 2007 9:43 am
Mr. Pat, the biggest question is whether you have till now, at all asked any questions?

All you pathetic being, suffering from actual verbal diarheaa, have done upto date is to make allegations spun up from the depths of your cancerous mind.

Big foreign goer, that you are, you have imbibed the worst of the WEST and brought that back, to the shores of India, to poison and destroy.

Wonder why, people like you are even given Visas to the West, when your comrades in arms like Mr Modi in Gujarat is denied the same.. But of course, you are not as infamous as Mr. Modi. Keep it up, Mr. Pat, at the rate you are progressing, you will soon catch up..

Further, as I had written earlier, I go by the name my parents had given me, and do not need to hide like you behind three letter names and four letter expletives.

For drawing room fascists like you, who worship the likes of Praveen Togadia and other riff-raff like him, the incident of my father fighting the Bangladesh War may appear to be a story; for all you gutless hounds do not have the courage of conviction to practice what you preach, such real -life - stories have actually contributed to the history of my motherland.

Grow up Mr.Pat, earn some maturity, your juvenile sense of being is actually harming the cultural fabric of my country..

Or, if you cant adjust to My India, emigrate, for there are still some countries in this world, who have need of spin-doctors and propagandists, and racists fools like you. Zimbabwe for one, would consider your application for citizenship with open arms..

And about not commenting, please don’t do, your inane blabber has already caused so much harm, that it would take time to repair..

People like you should be simply tagged as ENEMY OF THE STATE, put behind bars and the keys thrown away..
Neila on October 16, 2007 10:48 am
Mr. Rajib you are so poor in rational thinking, it was known to me. I have put two very recent (In 21st century) examples to show why some people are against Muslims. We have changed our thinking time to time but the Muslims are not. They are so Allah centric (irrespective of their educational background) minded which makes them backward day by day.
â€œKabuliwala’s Bengali Wifeâ€ writer is Sushmita Bandhopadhya, who lived in Afghanistan for six years, fleeing the country in 1995 after the Taliban issued a death sentence against her for refusing to convert to Islam. Where was her beloved husband Janbaaz Khan for whom she rebels against her parents and married? This modern woman brought up in Kolkata’s liberal environment starts feeling stifled in her husband’s regressive extended family which treats women like cattle. The same could be happened with Priyanka like the above. Believe it or not, it is the ground reality of the Muslim society irrespective of the location.

Here it has been noticed that people are confident about Rizwanurâ€™s death which was not normal. Because of some logic, we drew the conclusion about the death which was not suicide. And most of us are blaming the rich. Being a rich, should it be blame able? Then Why we are pointing to the rich.
As per me, Rizwanur is responsible for his death whether it is a suicide or a murder.
As per this house Rizwanur was talented and educated, so why he (from lower middle class family) did not think twice to marry his student who is a daughter of an industrialist. Was he not aware of his own background? If not then that was his foolishness and as a result paid his life for such a silly mistake. Rizwanur was more mature than his beloved, so he should have pulled back himself from the marriage and tried to convince his lover in a logical way to save himself and his family. Here the discussed affair was just one year old and I think this time is not sufficient to take decision to get married though there was a huge difference between the two. One can assume that he might have some game plan to get married to the industrialistâ€™s daughter soon, anything can happen if he late.
Pat on October 16, 2007 12:46 pm
Mr. Rajib,
Why do you have to make a jack as* of yourself whenever you open your mouth? My given name is indeed PAT. But you don’t have enough brains to grasp its meaning. And for all your other sadist remarks, NO COMMENTS.
RAJAN SAHNI on October 16, 2007 1:57 pm
It’s quite natural for Rizwanur’s family and civility at large to seek justice. Setting all communal bickerings aside we should keep our terms of reference focussed on one single issue that is unholy marrige between money power and administration, which is suppose to look after public safety and security.

But I qualitatively differ with those point of views where terms of reference has veered from the culpable offence to justification of relationship between two consenting grown up individuals. Mere attaining a certain age and having infatuation for someone do not qualify for a lifelong relationship while throwing all family values and such logicalities out of the window.

To invoke freedom of any sort one has to follow a certain laid out framework. In the name of freedom of choice you can not wreck havoc on others lives.

The logic should be a very simple e.g., a mother who has lost her son, has every right to seek justice. Similarly as a father Ashoke Todi had every right to intervene and should have tried to wean away his daughter from the clutches of incompatible marriage without creating a fiasco or resulting into loss of life.

There should be unbiased and level headed argument and not a mind tikling passionate and hate-bred arguments. We sincere condole over loss of a precious life.

In the land of Rama, Krishna, Buddha, Mahabir and Gandhi we cannot stoop down to the level of ferocity of cannibals. We do not call any one Kafir or Infidel and break all hell loose and exert all our power to believe what we believe in. We believe in all brotherhood and most endearing philosophy “Joto Mot Tato Path”, no confrontation hence no fear of losing any battle.

Our philosophy never taught us to hunt for the enemy and kill him merely because he is not one among us on the contrary we have been taught in our childhood the moral lesson from Mahabharata how Karna gave away his life-shield at his own peril to Indra in charity knowing fully well the consequence of losing the battle and his life.

Hence I would personaaly plead the guy, Rajib Banerjee to refrain from teaching us morality. We, Hindu have never historically infringed upon anybody’s freedom and safety. Alexender, Chengis Khan, Mohammad Ghori, Mughal or Britishers, we had never been invaders like them. We haven’t converted a single Jew, Chrishtian and Muslim into Hinduism. We had only sent peace emmissaries like Mahendra and Sanghamitra to other lands to spread love and peace as enshrined in Budhism.

We have not etched out our land from any other country like Pakistan and Bangladesh.

If people like Rajib and other Bong fellow should take pride to proclaim themselves as proud Hindus which allow you the freedom to express your minds whether sane or insane because we do not believe in FATWA or any such damning strictures to curb your expressions. Even China and other erstwhile Communist countries have their own unique suppressing machineries to curb your opinions, not in this land.

It is because it’s ARYAVARTA, pure land of the followers of SANATANA DHARMA which got sullied owing to above reasons. We worship Trees, animals, birds and snakes let alone harming a human kind, it’s just not us. Please understand that and make others to see this reasons.
vivek on October 16, 2007 2:12 pm
I . I don’t appreciate any murder even for a rat who creates lot of trouble in all houses.
2. In this case RIZWAN was not innocent but intelligent,savvy ,educated ,well mannered with charming personality. As such he was very keen to uplift his status thru’ good hindu female. Initially he initiated his fisrt love with Ms.Promy Roy in 2004. But after seeing Priyanka Todi and her immense wealth ,he changed his mind and beautifully crafted a rift between himself and Ms. Roy so that he can persue his love affair with Ms. priyanka. And then started his affairs with her. Being experienced in love ,he developed and nursed Priyanka in a manner that she was completely blind in his love without understanding his ulterior motive.Let me honest with all that all such muslim are too intelligent for any ordinary Hindu girl who is simple at heart and doesn’t understand much about future complication.
It’s really shame on all of us that our Hindu females get turn by these Muslims and ruin their life without uttering a single word.Neither we had collected any research data so far so that we can educate our girls as how to protect when any savvy Muslims boy try to impress.Look what Amir Khan, Saif ali khan did with their Hindu wifes. They both divorced them.
So in this case it was RIZWAN who acted smartly with rich Hindu female’s emotion and turned her completely love blind and that too with a student of his class and 8 years younger than him.Under such circumstances what a father can do? It is difficult for him to educate his love blind daughter till she comes into her senses which would happen only after 2/3 years latter when RIZWAN would have pressure her for money and on not getting that he would desert her or for plenty of other reason.
If the police has just played their role till 8/09/2007 then how they can be roped for future mis happening?
Was there any threat after 8/09/2007? If not ,then how one can say that he was murdered.
RAJAN SAHNI on October 16, 2007 6:02 pm
Itâ€™s quite natural for Rizwanurâ€™s family and civility at large to seek justice. Setting all communal bickerings aside we should deligently keep our terms of reference focussed on one single issue that is unholy marrige between money power and administration, which is suppose to look after public safety and security.

On the other hand I qualitatively differ with those point of views where terms of reference has veered completely from the culpable offence to justification of relationship between two consenting grown up individuals. Merely attaining a certain age and having infatuation for someone do not qualify for a lifelong relationship while throwing away all family values and such logicalities out of the window.

To invoke freedom of any sort one has to follow a certain laid out framework. In the name of freedom of choice you can not wreck havoc on others lives.

The logic should be a very simple e.g., a mother who has lost her son, has every right to seek justice. Similarly as a father Ashoke Todi had every right to intervene and should have tried to wean away his daughter from the clutches of incompatible marriage without creating a fiasco or resulting into loss of life.

There should be unbiased and level headed argument and not a mind tikling passionate and hate-breeding arguments. We sincerely condole over loss of a precious life.

In the land of Rama, Krishna, Buddha, Mahabir and Gandhi we cannot stoop down to the level of ferocity of cannibals. We do not call any one Kafir or Infidel and break all hell loose and exert all our power to believe what we believe in. We believe in all brotherhood and most endearing philosophy â€œJoto Mot Tato Pathâ€, no confrontation hence no fear of losing any battle.

Our philosophy never taught us to hunt for the enemy and kill him merely because he is not one among us on the contrary we have been taught in our childhood the moral lesson from Mahabharata how Karna gave away his life-shield at his own peril to Indra in charity knowing fully well the consequence of losing the battle and his life.

Hence I would personaaly plead the guy, Rajib Banerjee and his ilk to refrain from teaching us morality. We, Hindu have never historically infringed upon anybodyâ€™s freedom and safety. Unlike Alexender, Chengis Khan, Mohammad Ghori, Mughals or Britishers, we had never been invaders like them. We havenâ€™t converted a single Jew, Chrishtian and Muslim into Hinduism. We had only sent peace emmissaries like Mahendra and Sanghamitra to other lands to spread love and peace as enshrined in Budhism.

We have not etched out our land from any other country like Pakistan and Bangladesh have gobbled ours and planning further to take away Kashmir. While our eastern neighbour have stategically mobilised a huge influx of their impoverished populace into our country with a very clear design. Unfornately psuedo-secularist like Rajib Banerjee and his cohorts blissfully ignore such reality of life putting our life and existence into danger.

If people like Rajib and other Bong fellow should take pride to proclaim themselves as proud Hindus which allow you the freedom to express your minds whether sane or insane because we do not believe in FATWA or any such damning strictures to curb your expressions. Even China and other erstwhile Communist countries have their own unique suppressing machineries to curb your opinions, not in this land.

It is because itâ€™s ARYAVARTA, pure land of the followers of SANATANA DHARMA which got sullied owing to above reasons. We worship Trees, animals, birds and snakes let alone harming a human kind, itâ€™s just not us. Please understand that and make others to see this reasons.
riyaz on October 16, 2007 10:03 pm
“GOLI MAAR BHEJE MEN BHEJA SHOR KARTA HAI”
wel dear citizens i am realy happy to know that still my cuntry mans are matured@open mind,haan kuch log hain jo aisi fiza banate hain,jis se aj ke hitler ko madad milsake,,
wel kisi ne kya khoob likha aur bada khoob likha..ki muslims male shadi k baad hindu girls ko dubai le jaker sale kardete hain,,huh
wow best joke of 12st century,,hehehehe
those guys who agreed on tht point,,i have only 1 qstn if u reply me,,
wo girls jo AP se WB and nepal se maxm hindu.
mumbai ke bazaron men gulf men bech di jati hain unko kon lata hai yahan tak ?????kon hai
jo unka sauda bina shadi kerdeta hai..tab aise log kahan hutey hain..jab uper cast ka hindu lower cast ke hindu ko maan maryada ki duhai dekar poora ghar hi saaf kardeta hai..
ya tab ye log kahan hutey hain jab kisi gaun ka serpanch beech bazar men qatal ka fatwa dedeta hai bczo us ghreeb ne jo lower cast ka tha uper cast ki rajkumari se parem karliya..JAGO INDIA WALO JAGO..
ankita on October 16, 2007 11:37 pm
The murderer of this inhuman act should be hanged.It’s difficult to imagine tht our so called upcoming & educated society is unwilling to accept Love.Rizwanur was a innocent man , who was killed fr marrying a hindu girl;Let’s all gt united in our ndeavour to get the guilty punished.Shame on kolkata police.
Rajib Banerjee on October 17, 2007 9:41 am
Inspite of so very logical (sic.) individuals like Pat, the Honourable High Court has give a very logical verdict of transferring the investigation of the issue to the CBI.

Regrets to you Pat, with the cryptic and undecipherable three letter name, a sick mind and blatantly offensive expletives, Kolkata is still a logical place to live in, for our people still care.

And Mr. Sahni, supposedly unpatriotic Bongs (all people who live in Bengal) like us, are still organising a candle light vigil in front of my alma mater, so that Rizwanur’ death, does not get unpunished.

Your rampant campaign for the Todis and their money-power did not help after all..
Pratap on October 17, 2007 1:22 pm
Rahul,
It is because of people like you that we have forgotten that Love recognizes no barriers and we try to ajust and accomodate our Likings and Dislikings within caste,religion,money or country and sacrifice our true feelings.People like Rizwanur Rahman had the balls to stand by his woman and you????
Sikandar on October 17, 2007 2:29 pm
For the sake of a healthy debate would you guys who have taken upon yourselves the cudgels to fight injustice meted out to Rizwanur, answer me the following questions ?

1. Could Hitler and Mahatma Gandhi sleep together with their respective frame of minds ?

2. Can any father in his senses allow his well bred daughter brought up in a pious Hindu evironment live in a wretched, beef-eating, pauperized Muslim environment ?

3. In the name of God we maintain a very pure and serene atmosphere and engage ourselves into meditation as oppose to that Muslims howl at the top of their voice in the godly hour of morning ?

4. During any Puja and festival even non-vegitarian among Hindus abstain from eating devilish food habits while Muslim folk rejoice in killing dumb animals during these days. Even during Ramadan they eat flesh while during Navaratri it is beyond any Hindu’s imagination to think of such thing exceptions are there only in Bengal. Hence such huplala ??

5. Why historically, in fact more imminently these Moushis of India, Pakistan and Bangladesh are none other than lowly Hindus converted into Islam ? Because of that they have an obsessed mind to commit such things with a vengeance ?

6. They never participate in mainstream issues only engaged in Muslim centric issues ?
You will never find them part of us and always maintain a curious identity distinct from the rest ?

7. Major activities —- Terrorism, Grabbing other’s territories, Invading others in the name of Allah, Justifying all their misdeeds in the name of their religion, do not believe in peace, do not believe in Ahimsa, Constantly fight among themselves and with others, Live perennially in ghettos until they rob others, No creative activities except grudging others, always have parochial outlook ????

8. No single country where Muslims are in majority are Secular but they want India to be secular till such time Muslims are in minority here ?

9. Hence no compatibility possible.
Rajib Banerjee on October 17, 2007 3:52 pm
From the first, I have pointed out that Sikandar you and other gutless fools like you, hide behind false names and aliases. Why take the name of a Muslim to spout such utter rubbish? Coward..

My rejoinders to your nonsense..

“1. Could Hitler and Mahatma Gandhi sleep together with their respective frame of minds ? ” - What an example? When setting analogies, at least do it right, or keep that trap which you refer to as your mouth, COMPLETELY SHUT!

“2. Can any father in his senses allow his well bred daughter brought up in a pious Hindu evironment live in a wretched, beef-eating, pauperized Muslim environment ? ” -

What the hell does the father have to do with this since both were mature consenting adults? And for your information, sacrifice and eating of bovine cattle is still done in Kamakhya (Durga) mandir in Assam. The Rig Veda also contains references to the same. Eating beef is not a particular trait of the Hindus, you dolt.

“3. In the name of God we maintain a very pure and serene atmosphere and engage ourselves into meditation as oppose to that Muslims howl at the top of their voice in the godly hour of morning ? ”

- Yes, serene atmosphere you say, that’s why in the neighbourhood of all our religious places touts, and other shady characters flourish. A visit to any renowned temple in India, leaves you shaking in disgust, because of harrassments in the hands of priests and other carpet baggers.

And if Muslims, pray to God at an ungodly hour, think of the devotion involved when millions of people accross the globe sit in prayer before their allmighty five times a day, at regular hours, somethings which Hindus can learn.

“4. During any Puja and festival even non-vegitarian among Hindus abstain from eating devilish food habits while Muslim folk rejoice in killing dumb animals during these days. Even during Ramadan they eat flesh while during Navaratri it is beyond any Hinduâ€™s imagination to think of such thing exceptions are there only in Bengal. Hence such huplala ?? ” -

You moron, juvenile are your thought processes, Hindu sect is divided into worshippers of Shiva (Destroyer), Vishnu (presever) and Durga (power). People in the eastern parts of India, who are no less Hindu, eat flesh during specific Hindu festivals, which an ignorant fool like you will obviously not know.

“5. Why historically, in fact more imminently these Moushis of India, Pakistan and Bangladesh are none other than lowly Hindus converted into Islam ? Because of that they have an obsessed mind to commit such things with a vengeance ? ” -

My surname makes me a Brahmin and people of my caste and other higher castes had made life miserable for people in the so called lower castes, read about the Hindu caste system, idiot. The primary reaction of these people were to turn to Buddhism and when the Muslims came to India, to embrace Islam with its word of fraternity and equality for all.

“6. They never participate in mainstream issues only engaged in Muslim centric issues ?
You will never find them part of us and always maintain a curious identity distinct from the rest ? ” -

Have people like you ever treated them as mainstream? A boys death has been turned into a gleeful adventure by loonies like you, PAT and the other fundos. How do you expect the community to react, when their literacy rates are lower than us?

“7. Major activities â€”- Terrorism, Grabbing otherâ€™s territories, Invading others in the name of Allah, Justifying all their misdeeds in the name of their religion, do not believe in peace, do not believe in Ahimsa, Constantly fight among themselves and with others, Live perennially in ghettos until they rob others, No creative activities except grudging others, always have parochial outlook ????” -

All Hindus are saints right? That’s why the Indian Parliament, and most of them due to logic of demography are Hindu, in a majority have criminal cases lodged against them.

“8. No single country where Muslims are in majority are Secular but they want India to be secular till such time Muslims are in minority here ?” -

Why do we have to be bothered about other lands? It is my country and constitutionally our fore-fathers had decided that it is a secular democracy and till date they have been proved right.

Even writing back on comments like yours, give every Indian the shivers. What times we live in?
Soman on October 17, 2007 5:26 pm
Rajib couldn’t be the son of a soldier. He is sent from the depth of the hell to support jihadis and stays in the guise of a pseudo secular. Kolkata is still in the medieval age as where I have seen a human rickshaw first time .

Now about the CBI. We all know the so called CBI investigated Bofors Case and seen it’s fate. In kerala there are many cases to their discredit.
It’s been more than a decade since the CBI is digging for Chekannur Maulavi (Who was murdered by rivalry muslims) and his case,
still with no result. And Sister Abhaya case, more than eight teams of CBI investigated this case vertically, horizontally and diagonally and still groping in the darkness.
If rizwanur’s mother was in kerala she wouldn’t have asked for a CBI inquiry. After all CBI is under Manmohan and he is a play thing for madame Sonia and CPM.
Rajib Banerjee on October 17, 2007 6:05 pm
Sonam, I don’t need to prove my credentials to people like you who prefer hiding behind aliases. All through my posts, I have given much proof of who I am to knuckleheads like you, had my patriotism questioned, labelled a Bong and now a Jehadi Kolkattan who lives in the medieval ages.

Point is CBI may not come out with any thing due to pressures of the UPA Coalition, but still the govt. of W.B. had dirt rubbed on its collective face, when the Hon. High Court passed on the investigation to CBI.

And Kolkata Sonam, might be living in the medieval times, but at least the mindset is not pre-historic like you. Here people do not care who you are or how much money you have in your bank, before rushing in to help or to stand up for a just cause. Riots do not happen with the drop of a hat, too..

We might be materially poor, but we are rich in our hearts..
Arif Siddiqui on October 17, 2007 7:58 pm
to all above.after going thru all the comments on rizwan case,it was revealed to me that almost 90% of the persons are secular minded and I am glad for that. being a muslim i do not approve the marriage of rizwan and priyanka,unless she accepts islam.this is the islamic law.there is no exception.when he married priyanka as a hindu girl,he was not muslim anymore because he disobayed Allah’s order. as a human being rizwan’s murder case should be investigated and the responsible persons be brought to justice.
Soman on October 18, 2007 12:53 am
Arif, You want others to be secular and see what pathetic thinking you have.

>>>>> when he married priyanka as a hindu girl,he was not muslim anymore because he disobayed Allahâ€™s order

You are one of many pseudo-secular people on this forumn. I think you will make a good Ga* partner with Rajib. He like you guys and your thinking and the way you worship 5 times a day. In the remainder of your time, you can sleep with Rajib.

Don’t you have anyting to say about this guy, Rajib?
Neila on October 18, 2007 9:36 am
Dear Mr. Rajib How are you? Hope you are very happy with the High courtâ€™s order. So enjoy till the case is resolved. I have replied you in my last post and no more asking from your side; hope you have nothing to say on my comments â€¦.
Now, we donâ€™t have to go to Afghanistan or Bangladesh to see the Muslimâ€™s mentality, in this house we can see that, see the comments posted by one of your secular friend Arif Siddiqui.
We are shouting here because of this mindset my dear. Please try to be more logical, we may have a secular mind set but they are not and for them Allah more than anything else.
So what is the wrong with our thinking which we learnt from them?
India divided into three countries with two Muslim and one secular, do you know why?
For me it has happened only people like you. You must also know that when there is match between India and Pakistan and Pakistan win then Indian Muslims enjoy for that win, people like you so called secular can tolerate this sort of action but we canâ€™t . So who should wake up you or me â€¦.
Ghanghor on October 18, 2007 11:03 am
A Police Commissioner with a splendid record in the service has been transferred and is probably going to have to live through his retirement with this stigma. How does a perfectly good police officer suddenly change into a contract killer? How much money do you guys think would need to be paid to someone who has so much to lose? Why has no one blamed the father of the girl? The father was introduced to the comissioner by a common friend for help. Being a good man, he decides to help a helpless father of a girl who has married against their wishes and no one knows if any sort of pressure was involved there. The Police Commissioner probably asked some of his officers to look into the issue. No one has any idea as to what happened next. The man is dead, no conclusive investigation reports have been submitted and the bloody commies, scared that their islamic comerade who allows them to come into power year after year is hurting, the best thing to do is order some of the government officers transferred. I have not seen any single instance of any of these officers involved in wierd cases. Yet, why would anyone care. These are not officers of the Bihar and Haryana police where they attend and feed off the feet of thier political masters.
I do not support people being killed, but at the same time I hate the honest officers being made a scapegoat in this case.
Arif Siddiqui on October 18, 2007 6:14 pm
soman i am very sorry about your thinking.it is not healthy but filthy.the fact is fact.ask any muslim about what i mentioned whether my comment was right or wrong.before you throw mud on some one better get educated and then decide my answer.thank you and do not waste your time to again comment on my reply cause i am not coming back to this site.
rasmita on October 18, 2007 7:00 pm
there is nothing wrong in marriage or love between a hindu gal and a muslim boy but in one condition .Muslim should be that much liberal for a hindu boy and a muslim girl love or marriage also as they are expecting from hindus…………unfortunately they are not so..which causing problem here. I am a Hindu girl personally observed my muslim friends (boys) talk with us ,… chat with us .. but they don’t allow their sisters in same class or school to do so with Hindu guys including with my brothers….they come our house but dont allow their sisters to come.. I felt sorry many times for such feeling towards my brothers but could not express because I am having a fear of loosing friendship with them and bittering the relationship….we should clean ourself before pointing out others… I have never listened a hindu guy and a muslim girl marriage except some celibraty … what are u thinking only muslim guys are smart ? ??????? Do what are u expecting from others is the best solution… .think how can a sister tolerate same type of feeling toward her brother after marriage also. something muslim should think about….
Soman on October 18, 2007 10:21 pm
Arif, you are a big joker. You want us to ask your muslim brothers whether you are right or wrong. What a joke you assh***. Your muslim brother have same filthy thinking as you do. You piece of shit. Now go and make love to your sweethheart Rajib who was going ga ga over hindus and now has hidden his face after his beloved brother was exposed of his feeling and thinking.
Neila on October 19, 2007 11:55 am
No response from Mr. Rajib till date â€¦. What happens my dear friend? Are you OK?
Hope you must be busy with the great festival.
Here a lot of people are blindly (illogically) favoring Rizwanur as innocent, intelligent, educated etc. etc.
Now, does he really eligible to get such adjectives after his name? If yes please give your reason â€¦. Till now I have not seen a single justified logic behind it â€¦ very sorry about those people who are delighted to vigil candle light around their respective localities â€¦.
shweta on October 19, 2007 12:50 pm
After reading this article it seems that however educated and so called forward we are we can never let one live his or her life the way they want. We live in a free country and we all know that love does not happen after seeing the caste creed or may be the family of the individuals.all of us someday or other have fallen in love then why is rizwanur and priyankas love is different? This is the proof of the fact that we as indians can never think ahead castes. So what if rizwanur was muslim and priyanka a hindu were they not human beings first? Its high time now that we understand this coz there are many people who are waiting for some controversial replies to set their goals on the bodies of indians.I really dnt understand one thing too and that is how can people compare this incident with ,muslims selling hindu girls !!! has there never been a hindu person who sold girls or may be his wife then why get caste in it? Where is the similarity in muslim madarsas refusing to sing sareh jahan se acha and killing of a youth so brutally??? Growup people or you need to change your attitude towards all human beings or else we will be the ones who will be burning our own houses. Just think about this tomorrow if we are lying in a pool of blood in the middle of a road and someone from the muslim community comes ahead to help us even then shall we think in the same way ??? Learn to respect the individuals and the person in them not their caste only then we shall be able to see and find why we still are lagging behind.
rajesh on October 19, 2007 3:12 pm
hey shweta did u read rasmita comment…. if not go through it… i dont know whether u r hindu or a fake? comment on that…that is the feeling of every muslim… ok u need to grow up…..
Rishi on October 19, 2007 10:02 pm
We are no one to comment on the majority and minority , or on belief and superiority of any particular religion. No religion encourages violence and communal discrimination, and if at all it does , followers are not morons to go ahead and accept it blindly.The point is that a boy loved a girl, so much seriously committed that they got married LEGALLY. Who the hell are the political parties and the police to interfere in the issue.Cant they leave them alone to live a peaceful life?
SHYAM SInha on October 19, 2007 10:17 pm
Prasun Mukherjee s arrogance was misplaced

Buddhadev Bhattacharjee was naive enough
to even think that he would hush up this matter with his political shenanigans

BOTH OF THEM HAVE DEMEANED THIS GREAT CITY the birth place of so many of India s glorious sons!!
reshma khatun on October 20, 2007 1:51 am
rasmita is right….. I also think muslim women need more independence. I as a muslim woman observed that.
Soman on October 20, 2007 2:10 pm
Who is this other Soman appeared suddenly on oct 18th. ‘MONE KALI VELAYUDHANODU VENDA’. Soman is moon god and beyond your reach. I don’t subscribe your views. Arif is 100% correct and a muslim can’t have a hindu wife but can have concubines of other faiths.
feroza begam on October 20, 2007 10:06 pm
u r an idiot…
reshma khatun on October 20, 2007 10:07 pm
you r an idiot .. soman and arif
Finally, Mona Suri rests in peace : It’s Indiatime on October 21, 2007 8:36 am
[...] Why did Kolkata police murder Rizwanur Rahman? [...]
richy on October 22, 2007 10:19 am
well people like rahul do exist in all parts of the world…i dont blame him…personlly if rahul has experienced such things you cant blame him..but what i want to say to rahul is i can show you plenty of people from other religions also who are in the flesh trade …All i can say to people like rahul is ::believe in humanity”—humanity comes first…
indian on October 22, 2007 10:39 am
hey rahul…..you r a big hippocrite….4m where u got the idea that brothels are run by muslims?…..i guess u have a very good knowledge about brothels…hey do you own one?…..see pig dont judge man on the basis of religion…ok…you pig…understood….
Fighter on October 22, 2007 11:09 am
Nexus among Politicians, Government, Administration, Indutrialists, Police, Cricket and Criminals is now not a secret. Mr Buddhadeb Bhattacharya has made it very very clear by his actions and conduct that this nexus exists and is very strong. The Rizwan ur Rehman murder case will change the history of West Bengal. This case will root out the communist regime from the state, which they have been ruling since last 30 years……….

Mr Ashok Todi ( Chairman & Managing Director of M/S LUX Hosiery Industries Ltd., KOLKATA, West Bengal, India, & TIRUPUR, Coimbatore Dist, Tamilnadu, India. ) is the main conspirator in Rizwan ur Rehman murder case.
Whole case, activities, conduct , execution and cover up are the brain child of Mr Ashok Todi. All others are playing their role and part in the drama just only for money paid by Mr Ashok Todi to act as per his wishes. In the whole drama Mr Ashok Todi is the only person who have strongest motive to murder Mr Rizwan ur Rehman. Mr Ashok Todi must be arrested immidiately….

CBU must probe the whole chain of this nexus.

Mr Ashok Todi and Mr Anil Saraogi must be punished.

Do you think that CBI probe will be Impartial ???

In the back drop of the facts that Mr Vijay Shankar, Director of CBI is the batch mate and close friend of Mr Prasun Mukherjee, The Police Commissioner of Kolkata, & The President of Cricket association of Bengal,

This is also a fact that Mr Prasun Mukherjee and Mr Snehashish Ganguly both are middlemen between Mr Ashok Todi and the whole chain of nexus.

This is also known to all of us that Mr Prasun Mukherjee had made frequent trips to New Delhi after the Rizwan ur Rehman murder case became a Peoples” Movement, and met with CBI Director and IB Chief.

Why Mr Buddhadeb Bhattachajee, The Chief Minister of West Bengal & The Police Minister is trying to peotect Mr Prasun Mukherjee ?

Why Mr Prasun Mukherjee is trying to protect his Deputys” and other police officers ?

Why Mr Prasun Mukherjee is trying to protect Mr Snehashish Ganguly, Mr Ashok Todi, Mr Pradeep Todi, Mr Anil Saraogi and Todi Family ?

Had Mr Prasun Mukherjee made a deal with CBI Director Mr Vijay Shankar on behalf of Mr Ashok Todi during his recent meeting with him while he was on a trip to New Delhi ?

Therefore it is very necessary for all of us to keep a close watch, sharp eye, and constant vigil on the conduct of CBI and on all the activities related to Rizwan ur Rehman Murder Case.

Fire of Candle must be kept Burning.

1. What, Why, and Who provocked the police commissioner and other senior police officers to act against the law and procedure ?

2. Who is behind the death ( murder ) of Rizwan ur Rehman ?

3. Why the police commissioner was in so much hurry to declare the death of Rizwan as suicide in press conference even before geting the final post mortum report ?

4. What about the case of cricket betting and match fixing against Mr Ashok Todi for which he had been behind bars for one night and few senior officers of his company were also arrested ? What is the role of Mr Snehashish Ganguly, Mr Saurav Ganguly, and Mr Prsun Mukherjee in this case ?

5. What about the case of Hawala transactions from Dubai and Sharjah, related to some terrorist organisations, against Mr Ashok Todi, for which his office was rounded up and raided by Kolkata police and he went underground for many days ?

6 What is the secret behind a middle class businessman Mr Ashok Todi becoming a Industrialist worth Rs300 crores within a short span of ten years ?

7 Who are the political leaders, with whom Mr Ashok Todi and Mr Anil Saraogi are having connections ? What is the secret behind this nexus ?

8. Why Mr Buddhadeb Bhattacharjee supported the election of Mr Prasun Mukherjee to the post of the President of CAB ?

9. Where is the man who was in love with the first daughter of Mr Ashok Todi ( elder sister of Priyanka Todi ) ?? Why his fate and whereabout are still unknown ?

10. Why Kolkata police is not initiating the case against Mr Ashok Todi for misleading the police, filing false complaints and abuseing the process of law ?

11. Why no one is demanding the arrest of Mr Ashok Todi except the Congress party ?

Will we get answers ???????????????????????????????????????
anti-fighter on October 22, 2007 3:57 pm
MR fighter it should also be investigated how do u know such matters? dont prejustice? law will take its own course ..rizwan also a responsible ffor its own fate..
Shyamal Ray on October 22, 2007 6:22 pm
It’s pathetic to read these columns where there are galore of uncharitable, mindless blabberings without any sensible point of view. It is pertinent to add here that there could always be more opinions than one regarding any given issue.

Here the issue revolves around 2 mutually exclusive while equally sensetive issues.

1. Murder of a man, who is otherwise not known as a criminal.

2. A poor Muslim man alluring a very rich young Hindu girl into harriedly arranged marriage without following a minimum prerequisite of informing girl’s parents.

None of the above incidence could be treated lightly. Firstly no one has right to kill. Secondly, parents cannot be wished away just because someone has attained a certain age. It is quite obvious that Rizwanur had never been above board and it is certain that he had ulterior motive behind this marriage. Besides converting the girl into Islam, he must have set his eyes on the riches of Ashoke Todi.

In Bengal there is no single platform which could be apolotical including St. Xavier’s. It was foolish on the part of Prasun Mukherjee to utter uncharacteristically in a press coference which gave Buddhadev Bhattacharya baiters a very handy weapon to raise so called public opinion under some pretext.

People are going from one extreme to another for nothing. It is quite well known that Calcuttans take vicarious satisfaction in engaging themselves into nondescript and regressive issues but real issues do not excite them and hence they remain laggards nationally. They love to be a subservient to Islamic culture rather than lifting those down-cast people into prestine and ageless Sanatana Dharma which is not a religion but a way of exalted life. Where no single book pulls you back into medieval era while great sciptures of Vedic ages provides you a great vistas of human possibilities not merely as a mortal being but as a “Amritasya Putraha”, an Immortal being and no less.
LIC Agent on October 22, 2007 10:55 pm
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Indian (But not one of those hypocrits) on October 23, 2007 1:06 am
I am copying and pasting a couple of comments by other readers in other forumns which exposes congress and its hypocricy to appease minorities

1. Protest and burn if anything goes wrong anywhere else (Iraq, Afghanistan, Denmark(cartoon))
2. Attack a woman (Taslima Nasreen in Hyderabad) that too when she has no support and does not carry any weapons to protect herself
3. Demand subsidies for Haj tour even though it is tax money paid by everyone in the country (including tax money paid by majority of salaried Hindu employees)
4. Demand reservations on basis of religion (because Muslims are superior than others) in states like A.P, TN%u2026
5. Do not follow family planning because religion is more important than the Country
6. Call Hindus as %u2018Kafirs%u2019 when actually living in the land of majority Hindus
7. Trying to point out Gujarat riots (but what about Babar and other Muslim rulers?)
8. Asking for major share in national and natural resources (because PM Manmohan wants another term for 5 years)
9. Expecting fellow countrymen to live like Muslims in Muslim dominated areas
10. Saying oneself is a Muslim first and an Indian next (wonder how many feel that are Indians)

Sikhs getting slaughered in thousands = A MISTAKE.
Hindus getting killed in Kashmir = Political problem.
Muslims getting killed by a few hundred = Holocaust.
Poor protestors getting shot in WB under Left Govt = Misunderstanding.
Banning Parzania in Gujarat = Communal.
Banning Da Vinci Code and Jo Bole So Nihaal = Secular.
Kargil Attack = Government failure.
Chinese invasion in 1962 = Unfortunate betrayal.
Reservations in every school and college on caste lines = Secular. Reservations in Minority institutions = Communal.
Fake encounters in Gujarat [Sohrabuddin] = BJP Communalism.
Fake encounters under Cong-NCP in Maharashtra [Khwaja Younus] = Police atrocity.
Talking about Hindus and Hinduism appeasment = Communal. Talking about Muslims and Islam = Secular.
BJP freeing 3 terrorists to save 100 Indian hostages = Shameful
Congress freeing 4 militants to save just a life of one daughter of it%u2019s minister in Kashmir [Rubina Sayed] = Natural Political dilemma.
Attack on Parliament = BJP ineptitude. Not hanging Afzal Guru the mastermind despite Supreme Court orders = Humanity and Political dilemma.
BJP questioning Islam = Communal. Congress questioning Lord Rama%u2019s existance = Clerical Error.
Is there any end to Congress and it%u2019s shameless supporters hypocrisy

Media is just making us fool…..indians better beware or else you will be taken away by their cheap hidden agenda…of making this nation..anti-hindu regime…
hasan imam on October 23, 2007 5:56 am
really i think kolkata police is definetly involved in this case and and fitting a gunda by two ips off. for the murder of rezwanur rahman so cbi looking to this case now but why is not arresting those police off. really who is involved.by cbi i am very greatfull for sujata bose who is really interested in this case my salaam to him if possibale can u able to provide me his cell no or given to my cell no ehich is +919903235560 really this kind of people required in our civec soceity,

many tha,tha to him
rashi on October 23, 2007 4:11 pm
rahul…you are as guilty as the cops and the todis…i think you should be hanged publicly for spreading communalism and talking shit!!! people like you are the reason such atrocities take place and the reason why this country is still way behind…why dont you go lie down on the tracks it will be your service to mankind…please stop existing!!
Rishi on October 23, 2007 5:18 pm
answer these simple questions:

1. will a rich muslim family allow its girls to elope with a poor hindu boy?
2. will the muslim community allow a muslim girl to convert?
3.What would the muslim community do if a muslim girl converted to hindusim?
4.all those who have commented here allow their sisters and daughters to convert and have a love marriage?
5.Does muslim religion prohibit marriage with fire and idol worshipers ?

Lets face the truth…..
paithanker on October 24, 2007 6:07 am
dear friends,the matter was about the wrongful death of rizwan.now i am sorry to say that the religion is being criticized.please stop this nonsense and be a secular.thanks
Neila on October 24, 2007 11:36 am
Here most of the people are shouting for the hard lucky poor guy Riz, but why there is not a single justified reason seen so far. Can any one please dare to write about his greatness?
Partha on October 24, 2007 6:51 pm
I am horrified to find that this Rahul here is posting such inhuman lines. He is worse than the worst person involved in Rizwanur murder case. He will kill an innocent human with no reason but just for religion, I am sure. I am sad to know people like this Rahul call themselves human, call themselves Indians.
deepak on October 25, 2007 1:03 am
I dont understand why there r so many racist comments here. Open ur eyes *ss Hol** it might happen to you tommorow. Its such a pity and matter of disgrace people talk with such dumb racist attitudes. I really feel sorry for the Rehman. If I were priyanka I would take a gun n shoot the dad, uncle and all the stupid cops who ruined my life.. Never any desi dad ever dare to do a henious act like this again..
Bongi on October 25, 2007 3:25 am
What we see now is a little pre view..a wee peep into the new revolution that commies in bengal are trying to usher in the name of industrialisation. The present CM - who knows and ( practices) political dramatics but little economics fancies himself as the dalal of sundry local marwari buibessmen promsing and misleading by an illusion of prosperity the masses who elected him by robbing them of their home and hearths and offering these to his marwari business cronies and sidekicks for a song, The commies who have now tasted the forbidden fruits of market driven economy are now innovating newer ways and mechanisms to emerge as favour givers. money changes hands in this new power of playing god in the sordid game of granting favours. What we therefore see is the rise of latin american style crony capotalism complete with rhetoric spewing and prtending to be radical leaders, bihari poilice officers, bihari cab drivers messing kolkatas traffic ( they dont earn their bread in lalooland), marwari promoters systematically colonising kolkata- its language. Culture and traditions. All this thriving with Nandigram. Singur, the food riots, the poor state of public health care ( but profitable marwari run unscruoplous private hospitals working with indirect state patronage). Therefore we see the ilks of Todis - a history sheeter of economic crimes and one of bengals quick rich refugee / parasite being ardently protected for days even in the face of public outrage by a communist government that claims to be the messiah of the masses. Therfore the death of a middle class youth is of little concern to the likes of Todis that are abounding in Kolkata - who have exploited the city for decades. Raped its economy and culture ( remember most of the trade union unrest and industrial sickness were caused by the trader turned industrialist class bribing commie trade union leaders and for which the working people of the state were blamed) and now treat the underprevileged people as commodities. Any kolkatan who works with a marwari business knows of their misbehaviour, their immoral and unethical ways of doing business and leading life under a lofty garb of religion……..we will see more of Riz so long the pestillence of the likes of Todi and their cohorts are not purged………
Shah on October 25, 2007 6:34 pm
To all of you protesting rizwanur’s death/suicide: How many of you protest when Hindu women in Pakistan and Bangladesh are raped, tortured, and forced to convert to Islam? This is something that happens everyday with the support of the Pakistani and Bangladeshi authorities.

When Hindus are persecuted, then you bigots with your double standards never protest. However, even if there is the slightest suspicion of a Muslim not being catered to then you think its the end of the world.

What do you think in the RARE case that a Hindu man marries a Muslim woman and all the Muslims raise hell?
Shah on October 25, 2007 6:49 pm
Muslims donot allow their daughters to marry hindu boys and hindu girls have to convert after marrying muslim boys. This is unnatural and should be discussed in public domain also.
R.Sahni on October 26, 2007 1:26 pm
This Bongi sounding quite cacophonous and his bytes are one of those parochial outburst which is commonly observed in losers in a race. Since he could not run fast and therefore whoever is running ahead of him is a cheater. It is outdated. Your grumblings against Marwari and other business comminities are totally misplaced and unfounded as they are who are driving the economy of the county and create job opportunities for many in the land of non enterprising populace. Who is stopping you to jump on the bandwagon and do something economically good for yourselves and others.

While I’m amazed at your imbecile attitude towards parasites like Bangladeshi Muslims who are not only eating into your vitals but ensuring another Bangladesh to be etched out of your land which they have already succeeded to a great extent. But people like me are more concern about the plight of our country because your lackadaisical attitude.

Look people like Mittal / Hiduja / Swaraj Paul do not require turn like Kolkata to grow, in fact they can grow even in moon or Mars.

You better learn to look after yourself properly rather than spitting your scum all round without a purpose.

We have hold our ijjat before anything and hence cannot compromise on our daughter marrying a Moushi who is a convert.

Historically in Rajasthan Rajputs had fought Mughals and maintained their dignity by not converting themselves into Islam while highest converts among Indian are Bengalis because they consider their non-combative, meek and ever-ready-to-surrender disposition as liberal and progressive outlook. This forward-benting aptitude has brought about a huge degeneration in your culture which is not at all a matter to be proud of.

These moushis always ogle at Hindu girls and therefore every Todi has equal right to do whatever it takes to extricate his daughter from the scum. A weakling like you and your ilk may stomach the insult but not us.

Rizwanur could dare to do it in Bengal but his siblings would never dare to dream the same in Rajasthan, Gujarat or any other Hindi speaking belt. It’s not that they are less literate or economically weaker, in fact they would prefer to die rather than to submit.
Jai Hind: Proud to be an Indian » Is This How You Want Your Law Enforcement to Be? on October 26, 2007 2:51 pm
[...] this Muslim guy had married a Hindu girl, daughter of a rich industrialist called Ajay Todi. Read here how police negotiated with Rizwanur to send his wife back to nurse her so-called ill father. And [...]
Neila on October 26, 2007 4:39 pm
Thanks,R.Sahni. I DON’T UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE R SHOUTING BLINDLY. Such type of incidence happening everyday where innocent hindu girls r converting byforce, no hue and cry for those …and bustard media do not get information. We Hindus have to awake up to protect ourselves from the worst primitive wild mentality Muslims.
We Need A Big Change: Law Enforcement 2 « Visceral Observations on October 26, 2007 4:41 pm
[...] that he had married a Hindu girl, daughter of a rich industrialist called Ajay Todi. You can read here how police negotiated with Rizwanur to send his wife back to nurse her so-called ill father. And [...]
yakub on October 26, 2007 6:24 pm
What rahul is saying is correct.
our religion is like that only.
history will show that muslims have killed their brothers/sisterms/fathers for power/money.
So Rahul salute to you, you are a true India.
Matador on October 27, 2007 2:45 am
Bongi…. Your assessment is incisive of the forces behind this sordid events…..of money power……..and R Sahani looks like A (Asshole) Todis chamcha….
He seems to be an invincible ignorant like a pighead, of the history and geography of the Indian nation. Bal Ganghadar Tilak held -what Bengal thinks today India thinks tomorrow. The idelogue founder of Indias rigjht wing party ( which most of Sahanis tribe owe natural alleigance ) is in(ac)cidentally one from Bengal, Shyamadas Mukherjee. The liberalisation of India did not start in 1991 to emancipate the now formidable Indian middle class from 40 years of bania raj but was in the 1880s by none other than Dr Raja Rammohan Roy and Swami Vivekananda who took India to the West ( after Jagat Sett. One bania snake had helped Robert Clive to usurp India). He talks of valour of the Rajputs that make up for the anals of Rajputana - etching the glorious history of India……Sahani seems to have inherited adulterated saturated fat in his brains or at best his knowledge of history is restricted to the milawat of popular comic strips……..the lumpens whose brief he holds…are the lowly traders (…and not the valiant Rajputs., the warriors) who would bribe their way to win…..rather than lay down lives but deify sati ( and not jauhar) He has tried to dress fat pigs in borrowed tiger skins……he should look at the sacrifices ( for which his tribe has prospered by economically robbing free India )of khudiram bose,. Binay bose, of bagha jatin mukherjee and last but not least Netaji Subhas Bose…..he should go back to kindegarten before commenting on the people of bengal of servitude……….may i challenge him to cite one freedom fighter from his tribe who has laid down his life for the country……( he may not for they were then busy money lending or hoarding essentials!….the tradition continues among the countrys best known scamsters, corporate frauds. Tax dodgers….economic criminals… The road to the crooks gallery.which Sahani calls enterprise)
For once he is right……Sahanis ilks have prospered in places where people are tolerant and in a place like Bengal where the culture and upbringing fosters majority of india Nobel laureates……Tagore, Amartya Sen……have not yet chosen to kick them into the Bay of Bengal.
For his kind information Hindujas are the industrious Sindhis and the Pauls are proud Punjabis…….
To describe the lack of enterprise is wrong.The Rajat Guptas of McKinsey and A Bose of Bose Speakers……..to cite a few have global footprints…..which the likes of Sahani and his tribe have shunned….instead exploiting the common countrymen incestually …….by bribing bureaucrats and sundries….cheating workers……..robbing customers……donating to charities……and hawalas…… betting… Dodging taxes….manipulating……robbing banksand tax payers money.all that was the Indias license raj…….they have been so induistrious that they needed crutches to be in the top industry houses…….and swadeshi movements to suirvive against MNCs which brought the fruits of competition for the welfare of Indias vast exploited ,masses…….and many of them realised they were petty traders masquerading as industrialists.
Sahni should introspect on gracing recent history with the glory of being the scumy anus of the Indian nation rather than bask in the misplaced illusions of chivalry and valour by misappropriating ( as is their genetic get up) the anals of great historical traditions of India…..medeival and modern….
NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE FURY OF THE PATIENT AND TOLERANT……..
durgesh on October 27, 2007 11:18 am
this is very wrong done by the ashok todi and the cops of kolkata…. as this can bring the difference between two religions hindu , muslim… which is hardly settle in india from last 10 yrs…. we should prepare a example dat atleast 25 pairs of hindu -muslim should marry on one day and set an example for a country… by giving it a promo…. by india times …..

durgesh sarda
R.Sahni on October 27, 2007 12:33 pm
Let me clarify that neither do I hold brief for petty traders like Todi nor do I support the killing per se. But ijjat ke liye kuch bhi kar sakta hai.

While I vehemently despise the bankrupt and self-defeating dolts like Bongi, Metador and their ilks who hold brief for Moushis. I doubt them being Hindus with having any self respect.

Let us not drag Great Icons of history like Lord Buddha, Great Ashoka, Vidyasagar, Swami Vivekananda………..into mucky ejaculation of your insipid mind.

At the same time let us not brag on the laurels of individual achievers and rot yourselves into obscurity.

It is historically tested fact that in the face of cultural and social crises, an awesome social churning takes place and as a result of such processes the crucible of society moulds certain personalities to lead the rest depending upon immanent social and cultural needs of the society.

When peace and purity loving Bhratiyas invoked peace they got Lord Buddha, When deluded French looked for a leader, they got Nepolean as per their bidding. But marauders like Changes Khan and the Muslim invaders have totally ravaged the prestine and glorious social and cultural tapestry of India. As a dead weight of the society Muslims escalate backwardness and promote all social and cultural decadence. Supporting them amounts to promoting regressive forces and diehard criminals.

Since the social and cultural degeneration have struck such a deep roots in our society that we have forgotten all our values and basic self respect and get carried away by cheap popular gimmicks in the name of social justice.

Hence I would like to tell these demented, uncouth pariahs not to sermonise us with their half-baked, borrowed knowledge…nay indoctrinated blabberings.
msn on October 28, 2007 1:34 am
Kolkata: Minutes before he died, Rizwanur Rahman had dialled his father-in-law Ashok Todiâ€™s mobile number and spoken for nearly two-and-a-half minutes. The person at the other end might have been his wife Priyanka Todi who, the CBI suspects, told him that they should split.

â€œThat call might have made him decide to end his life,â€ a CBI officer said, explaining that the conversation was enough to convince Rizwanur that Priyanka wouldnâ€™t return to him. Why would Priyanka want to split with a man she eloped with after defying her parents? The possible answer could lie in an affair between Rizwanur and another woman, Pompy.

There are several indications that the old affair came between Rizwanur and Priyanka. Three days before Rizwanur died, Priyanka had spoken to Pompy for 35 minutes. This was after she had left Rizwanurâ€™s home to visit her parents. â€œIt seems she (Priyanka) had not known about Pompy earlier. After hearing of the affair, she might have allowed herself to be convinced not to return to Rizwanur,â€ the CBI officer said. Since then, Priyanka has pledged her love for Rizwanur. She told interrogators and Womenâ€™s Commission members that she missed him but the CBI still thinks the couple had been discussing Pompy the day Rizwanur died.

In fact, after his call to Todiâ€™s mobile, Rizwanur called up Pompy from a PCO booth at 9:30 am. â€œThe two had not been seeing each other for three years, but now they spoke for 170 seconds,â€ the officer said.

Before making the two calls, Rizwanur had sent an SMS each to Priyankaâ€™s father and mother, trying desperately to speak to his wife. His last message to Ashok Todi was: â€œPapa, everything is all right. I am going.â€ His next call was to Pompy.
Aparajita on October 29, 2007 12:56 pm
Rahul,if u can’t support the proper reason then it’s better not to pain ur fingers by typing these kind of stupid thought. It is people like u who really has brought disgrace to indian society. As an indian if u can’t do anything or can’t say anything logical then atleast feel pitty for Rizwanur Raheman’s unnatural death.
Lucky Khaitan on October 29, 2007 1:04 pm
This is just another media story, nothing else. Daily so many people are murdered, not even a fir is lodged, here the top cops have lost their office. Instead of focussing so much on this story, media should highlight issues of more public importance rather than individual stories. Till now so much news has been created. but at last the outcome is for sure that no one can even harm Ashok Todi as he isn`t an ordinary person. This Rahman has become a headache even after death for everyone.
paithanker on October 29, 2007 6:07 pm
you are an ass …todi is not above the law.you did not read the news of amamini.he is in jail now,he was also a powerful man.just wait and see.
sankar on October 29, 2007 6:47 pm
Friends,

I am watching for a day when I can see the Gods of all religions stand blessing in all the places of worship of all the religions indicating that God is one appearing in different forms. God sent us here to realize him. Let the people of all religions go and worship in the places of worship of other religions. Whether it is idol worship or idolless worship, let us seek first ‘Who am I’. God is like electricity which appears in fan or light or in a running machine. We have no right to abuse nor eliminate any one including an animal or creature. Some people may not believe the existence of God. OK. Let us respect each other and be kind to all spieces in the world.
Matador on October 30, 2007 1:14 am
Yes Shankar, you have now struck the right chord in this clutter and cacophony of…….who dun’ it…of the creed that is at wrong and the creed that has been wronged. We seem to have drowned in an abyss of mindless ignorance , in an orgy of frothing abuse that seemed to have blinded us of all around. We need to realise that it is a war of the good..the’Mazda’ and the evil of ‘Ahura’……. What we find in the Zend Avesta, the holy scriptures which the religious path preached by Zarostriasm. It is no coincidence that Ahura is phonetically and in symbolism the same as ‘Asura’ of the religious path of Hinduism. It is no coincidence in time and space too that the spirit of substance without Form in the omnipotent power of Divinity and that in the Almighty Allah and Nirakar in the Hindu philososphy are of similar analogy. It is also of interesting similarity to note that Krishna of Mathura and Christ ( or Krishtho….we Indians pronounce) of Bethlehem evolved from a common chronicle of nativity…….of Herod who cruelly put all babies to death because of the fear that a King of Jew will be heralded…….and that of Kansha who interestingly at different millenias had the same phobia………it is no coincidence that Krishto belonged to a family of sheperds and Krishna of the goalas ( or shepherds too!). Had it ever crossed our minds that there is recognition of life after death in all religious paths?……. In Islam of the jins in heaven….in the Doomsday of Christianity, of heaven and the angels…….and in Hinduism of fairies and apsaras of heaven with the devils of Hell and hell fire….the Yama Raja arbitrating. The ticket to Heaven or to Hell……the acceptance of a iife beyond death ( which Buddhism pefected to transmigration of soul and the endless cycle of birth and death..) in all religions is tied by the commonality of good deeds….. that all religion recognises is in the perfection of human conduct as opposed to sin or paap or misdeeds.
If a comparative study of the basisc of all religion point to Divinity and the Creator as a formless but omnipotent force that guides humanity all of whom are born equal we may seem to subscribe to what Jhon Lennon dreamt of the harmony of ebony and ivory…..the differentiation is not of what is the colour of our skin, our religious branding and subbranding but of the good deeds that we do to our fellowbeings…….as Christ preached of loving thy neighbours as thyself……..of the superiority of Insaniyat or Humanity E
Matador on October 30, 2007 2:49 am
…….sorry folks…..ideas got truncated……but I must soft land the train o thoughts……..we the citizens of India belong to a cofluence …a convergenc of complex but innately good influences over time…….the philosophical symbolism of the eternal fdlowing Ganges encompasses the infinity of time, space and motion of the Indian civilisation. As our friend ?sahani mentioned of the crisis of our great civilisation and our history’s answer by the eddies of convergence….. To pacify the volatility of the social cauldrum…. Sahni mewntions of Buddhism…..as the much awaited confluence to resolve the transformation of the spritual Vedic Hindusim into a degenetared politicised amf form driven Brahmanical hindusim…..the echoes of which bwyond the shores of India to the Far East and Japan……to Taoism and their variants…..Modern India never ignored it too….for Human Global Political system’s colossus was M K Gandhi……the greatest Saint Statesman as some one described him…..the lingering shadows were in the footprints over human history’s sands of time…..of Nelson Mandela, of Desmond Tutu, of Mohammad Yunus and Martin Luther King…….all had a common spirit oif sacrifice, of service, of raising the downtrodden…..be it the sudras of few thousand yearas ago or harijans of recent times……emanciopating all stratas created by the poitical forces to stratify and rule the contemporary economy on narrow, vested grounds of sectarianiasm.

To ignore the emergence of Sikhism, of Sufism, of Brtahmo Samaj…….each at their points of inflexion of our great Indian civilisation…..is to fail in deriving the relevance of the great divesity that is India……..that produced the greats of Ajatasatru amd the first political state in India…….Ashoka……with his Dhamma…..Akbar….with his Dar ul Alam……Nehru with his PanchSheel that foresaw there can be no unipolar world and the Mhalanobis Plan to make India self relioant…….Lal Bhadur Sastri who saw the jai in kisan and the Jawan and his ethical sense to sacrifice his railway monistership…..though not being the driver of the train that crashed…….of Indira Gandhi of making India a great millitary power and the Green Revolution……of Rajiv Gandhi who planted the saplings so that India could be a technical powerhouse as of today……of V P Singh who raised the Dalits to a power to help themselves tio do good and change how the cow belt of yesterday now shapes our great Indias destiny……..of Narashima Rao who emancipated the spirit of Indian enterprise……and of A B Vajpayee who saw India into the G 8 economic superpower. The National Highways that link the culture that is India…….and ironically esposuing Hinduitva but delivered India free from the fetters of Hindu rate of growth. Yea they all had warts………of patricide……… Kalinga…..of a dynasty that produced a bigot like Aurangzeb…….of a belief that dynasty can lord over a greay and vibrant democracy……of emergency…….of gunboat diplomacy and botched deals……..of burning youth in the streets……..of moneybags and siblings……of the Godhra carnage……..yes but they all did their bit for what India is today. .

Yes we all live happily together, Rahul, Sahni,Rajib, Bongi et al…..because we see tolerance in co exitence, free expression of thoughts…..in a crucible where the early Aryans rampaged from her western borders……the Kushanas…….the Turks…….all seeking the nectar that was in Hindustan…….we therefore have a collage of the Dravidians who may complain of invading Aryans ( the north india brahmis) who in turn may complain of the Rajputs ( the Kushanas) and everyone of the Turks…….But what we see is an icon like A P J Abdul Kalam…a muslim wel versed equally in Koran and the Tiruvalluvars…..in nuclear physiocs and modern aeronautics and space sciences……the devoutness of a Muslim and the spiritualism of a Hindu with the m,aterialism of the best in Christian state. ironically anointed in the high noon of Hindutva - that is the paradox of our India……where purda is a way of Hindu life…….where biriyani and phirni is an Indian delight….where qawalis are culural folklores….where the Khans are Bollywoods stardom……of Pathans are match winners against Pakistan…….and A P J Abdul Kalam is the father of the secular H bomb.
What does this rambling analysis signify of the Rizwan,’s sad demise? I would urge my countrymen to Awake and Arise as Swami Vivekanda mentioned.Our India is now a civilisation that is propelled by the economy…..of opportunities….of the power of knowlewdge where the right to information is the cornerstone of every citizens progress…..where human dignity irrespective of his / her economic standing…..and economic standing is a function of ones unfettered ability or the lack of it………..Religion is a misnomer is this classless society where Lord Ramakrishnas profound observation holds sway…….that every religion are varied paths to the same confluence of all that is good in huimanity. To divide the society and the great Indian civiliozation on grounds of religion are the works of cowards, rogues and pariahs……who do not deserve to describe them as a true Indian.

What the Indian democracy will expect those that it had elected to deliver is…….good governance…..where there is Rule of Law…….and not expect that the babus and the sepais living on tax payers money to deliver marriage counselling services….or.behave like a neighbourhood bhai…….all for little bakshish.

what the people of India would probably like to see that justice be meted out to the culprits….that the nexus of the demented rich and a corrupt state apparatus be destroyed……..as in these momentous times events need to be analysed throughj the lens of faiorness and juistice and not by blinkers of religion.
In India of our times we have four national colours…..not just the saffron, the green and the white…..of the hindu/ sikh, the muslim and the christian/jains/buddhist………but the blue…..of the Indian cricket team…..
What matters is right comnduct…….economic, social and moral……and not brandishing the dogmas culled out of religion…….for as Lord Ramakrishna mentioned these are different streams to a same confluence………whether you call Pepsi or Coke to the same sweet fizzy water……
LONG LIVE THE IMMORTAL LOVE OF RIZWAN - PRIYANKA……A CELEBRATION OF HUMANITY…..A CELEBRATION OF THE SPIRIT OF THE INDIAN NATION……..DOWN WITH THE CRONIES AND CROOKS……WHO DID THE VILE ACT…..AND THEIR COHORTS……..LET SATYAMAVE JAYATE FOR JAI HIND…!!!!!!

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Firdaus on October 30, 2007 4:44 pm
Islam and Women

I could not remain a Muslim because Islam hates women. I think I always knew this, but as I got older that knowledge became more acute, Islam wants women to cover themselves, to stay indoors, to obey men, however stupid those men are. Islam says that women are inferior in every way. Islam distorted my fatherâ€™s feelings. He did not want us, his own daughters, to be happy or fulfilled. He only wanted us to be good Muslims and for daughters this means to be suffering Muslims. What sort of religion forces fathers to make their daughters suffer? What sort of father thinks that his daughterâ€™s hair is shameful? What sort of father tells her she cannot sing and dance when she is happy? A Muslim father.

This is why I am not a Muslim. My children, boys and girls, will be able to feel the wind in their hair. They will not be ashamed. They can sing and dance as much as they like. Nothing they do will shame me, as long as it is done with life and joy. Islam has no joy. Islam is a cult of tears and death.

Testimony submitted to the web site of the Institute for the Secularization of Islamic Society

A man is never alone with a woman without Satan also being present.
Hadith Al-Albani, Sahih al-Jami, vol. 1, p. 234.]

Western Muslim’s Racist Race Spree (frontpagemag.com 12/27/05)

The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property,
either as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of slavery
until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men.

Sir Winston Churchill, The River War, Vol. II, pp. 248-50, London: Longman, Green & Co., 1899)

Movie about the Violent Oppression of Women in Islam

On this web page, I discuss the Islamic attitude toward women. This attitude can be divided into the Islamic attitude toward infidel women and the Islamic attitude toward Islamic women. I start with what Islamic sources say and then give examples of how this is being put into practice in modern times. It is important to keep in mind that not all Muslims think alike, and that there are Muslims who are respectful of both infidel and Moslem women.

In a frontpagemagazine symposium (Gender Apartheid and Islam, 12/30/04) Ali Sina argued with two apologists for Islam’s teachings on women, Ms. Julia Roach and Mohammad El Mallah. Mr. Sina said:

Let us see what the Quran says about women. It says â€œmen have a degree (of advantage) over themâ€ 2:228 ; that the witness of woman is worth half of that of man 2:282; that women inherit half of their male siblings, 4:11-12; that a man can marry two or three or four women 4:3; that if a women becomes captive in a war, her Muslim master is allowed to rape her 33:50; that if a woman is not totally submissive to her husband she will enter Hell 66:10; that women are â€œtilthâ€ for their husbands (to cultivate them) 2:223; that men are in charge of women, as if women were imbeciles or minors who could not take care of themselves; that they must be obedient to their husbands or be admonished (verbally abused), banished from the bed (psychologically abused) and beaten (physically abused) 4:34.

These verses define the station of women in Islam…

Ms. Roach laments that Islam is not practiced in all parts of the world by all Muslims to the standard prescribed by Allah in the Qurâ€™an.

For that we should give thanks to God. Imagine if all Muslims were to stone or hang victims of rape or flog women for minor offenses such as exposing a flock of hair. In fact, the countries that practice Islam to its fullest are truly barbaric. Just think of the suffering of the women in Afghanistan during the rule of the Taliban. Women were not allowed to go out of their homes or work. Male doctors were not allowed to visit female patients. So, when women became sick, there was no one to take care of them and they died. The more a country becomes Islamic the more hellish it gets.

Ms. Roach comforts herself by thinking that after women die they can expect to be treated equally and says â€œWomen’s souls have equal value to those of Men’sâ€. In other words, what she is saying is that while women live a life of slavery, abuse and deprivation in this world they can rejoice because after they die they will be treated equally. Although I find this a vacuous bargain, the truth is that even this promise is not true. Women in Islam are not treated equally even in death.

Men are promised many virgins after they die. What do women get? They get their old lousy husband to share with 72 voluptuous celestial virgins. With that many high-bosomed houries why would any man want to spend a night with an old wife? Do women get also young celestial studs to have orgies with? No they donâ€™t. They have to maintain their â€œmodestyâ€ even after their death. The truth is that in Islam men and women are not treated equally even after their death.

In fact, according to Muhammad few women ever make it to Paradise . The majority of them end up in Hell. Let us see what the Prophet says in this regards. This is where he describes his hallucinatory visit to hell and paradise:

“Then I saw the (Hell) Fire, and I have never before, seen such a horrible sight as that, and I saw that the majority of its dwellers were women.” The people asked, “O Allah’s Apostle! What is the reason for that?” He replied, “Because of their ungratefulness.” It was said. “Do they disbelieve in Allah (are they ungrateful to Allah)?” He replied, “They are not thankful to their husbands and are ungrateful for the favors done to them. Even if you do good to one of them all your life, when she seems some harshness from you, she will say, “I have never seen any good from you.’ ” Bukhari 7.62.125…

She [Ms. Roach] also claims that a Muslim woman has the right to sexual satisfaction within her marriage and clarified that â€œif a woman is unsatisfied she can obtain a divorceâ€. Is that true? Under the Sharia women are not allowed to divorce even if their husband beats them. The decision to divorce rest only on man’s whims. Now imagine a women going to a Judge demanding divorce accusing her husband of impotency. How can you humiliate the gigantic ego of a Muslim man and expect to live after that? She will be a dead woman the next day. If she survives and manages to divorce, she will be seen as a whore by everyone. A divorced woman has nowhere to go in the Islamic world. I do not know whether Ms. Roach has ever lived in an Islamic country. Muslim women are not allowed to have any libido. It is not pious for women to have sexual feelings. In fact the genital mutilation is designed to take away any sexual pleasure from them. Women are not supposed to enjoy sex. If they have any libido, there is a risk that they may fornicate and commit sin. Women must only provide satisfaction to their husbands and deny all their own sexual needs. According to a tradition:

Allah’s Apostle said, “If a husband calls his wife to his bed (i.e. to have sexual relation) and she refuses and causes him to sleep in anger, the angels will curse her till morning.” Bukhari 4.54.450

It is hilarious to think that the angels have nothing better to do than sit around and curse the poor woman all the night for depriving them from watching the live porno show. If Allah must punish woman for not satisfying the sexual needs of their husbands why does he needs angels to lobby him for it? Isnâ€™t it a waste of angelâ€™s resources?

In one sense this is all truly very funny. But in another, much larger sense, it is a tragedy…

I think it is worth mentioning that in Saudi Arabia if a person has been killed or caused to die by another, the latter has to pay blood money or compensation, as follows:

100,000 riyals if the victim is a Muslim man

50,000 riyals if a Muslim woman

50,000 riyals if a Christian man

25,000 riyals if a Christian woman

6,666 riyals if a Hindu man

3,333 riyals if a Hindu woman

Source: The Wall Street Journal, April 9, 2002

So as you see people’s worth are not the same in Islam. It depends on their gender and their religion.

In the Koran (4.34) it is written:

Men are in charge of women, because Allah hath made the one of them to excel the other, and because they spend of their property (for the support of women). So good women are the obedient, guarding in secret that which Allah hath guarded. As for those from whom ye fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds apart; and scourge (beat) them. Then if they obey you, seek not a way against them Lo! Allah is ever High Exalted, Great.

In addition to the Koran, Mohammed’s teachings are included in the Hadith. Next to the Koran, is is the most important part of Islamic law, its teachings are just as binding. The following quotes from the Hadith are from the “Sahih Al-Bukhari”. In volume 3:826 of Sahih Al-Bukhari Muhammed is quoted as explaining why a witness of a woman is equal to half that of a man. He said

This is because of the deficiency of the woman’s mind.

This argument was caught on tape in Birminghamâ€™s Green Lane Mosque.

â€œAllah has created the woman â€“ even if she gets a Ph.D. â€“ deficient. Her intellect is incomplete, deficient. She may be suffering from hormones that will make her emotional. It takes two witnesses of a woman to equal the one witness of the man.â€

Mohammed also quoted as saying that:

I was shown the Hell-fire and the majority of its dwellers are women 1:28,301;2:161,7:124

and that:

I have not left any affliction more harmful to men than women 7:33

The Koran commands men to beat women who are disobedient.

Sura 4:34 of the Koran says,

â€œMen are the managers of the affairs of women . . . Those women who are rebellious â€” admonish them, banish them to their couches, and beat them.â€

In Tirmzi P439 we find:

If a woman’s conduct is mischievous or immodest, the husband has the right to beat her up (Tirmzi P439)

These religious commands of Islam help us understand why Mohamed Kamal Mustafa, A prominent Muslim preacher from Italy authored a book Women in Islam, in which he wrote that verbal warnings followed by a period of sexual inactivity can be used to discipline a disobedient wife. If that failed he said that according to Islamic law, beatings could be then judiciously administered. “The blows should be concentrated on the hands and feet using a rod that is thin and light so that it does not leave scars or bruises on the body.”

These commands also help us understand a Muslim web site titled How To Beat A Wife (5/1/05).

More Islamic commands in regard to women are listed below.

It is forbidden for a woman to be seen by any man except her husband when she is made up or well-dressed. (Tirmzi P 430)

A woman is not a believer if she undertakes a journey which may last three days or longer, unless she is accompanied by her husband, son, father

A woman must veil herself even in the presence of her husband’s father, brother and other male relations. (Tirmzi P 432)

She is forbidden to spend any money without the permission of her husband, and it includes giving food to the needy or feast to friends. (Tirmzi P 265)

A wife is forbidden to perform extra prayers (NAFAL) or observe fasting (other than RAMADAN) without the permission of her husband. (Tirmzi P 300)

If prostration were a legitimate act other than to God, woman should have prostrated to her husband. (Tirmzi P 42

If a man is in a mood to have sexual intercourse the woman must come immediately even if she is baking bread at a communal oven. (Tirmzi P 42

A woman who seeks KHULA i.e. divorce from her man, without a just cause, shall not enter paradise. (Tirmzi P 440) A husband can divorce his wife at will.

Majority of women would go to hell. (Muslim P 1431)

If a woman refuses to come to bed when invited by her husband, she becomes the target of the curses of angels. Exactly the same happens if she deserts her husband’s bed. (Bukhari P 93)

A woman in many ways is deprived of the possession of her own body. Even her milk belongs to her husband. (Bukhari P 27) She is not allowed to practise birth control either.

Ibn Masud reported, “We were fighting with the Messenger of Allah, and our wives were not with us. We asked the Messenger of Allah, ‘Should we castrate ourselves?’ The Holy Prophet forbade us from that, and then he allowed us Muta (temporary) marriage. So, we all married wives for a fixed time (usually three days) for the dowry of a piece of cloth.” (Al Hadis, Vol. 2, p. 686)

Here Mohammed clearly tells the Muslims to forget about the prostitutes they had purchased for a handful of dates back home and to have fun with these new victims who come even cheaper. They can be bought and violated for only a piece of cloth. Allah is truly merciful! Praise be to Allah!

For more quotes about women and other aspects of Islam see The Incredible Teachings of Muhammed.

The reasons that the beauty of women needs to be suppressed are explained in A book [Document No. 47] published by the Institute of Islamic and

Arabic Sciences in America, formerly an outpost of the state-financed and controlled

Imam Muhammed Ibn Saud Islamic University in Riyadh, copies of which were collected

from Al-Islam Mosque in Washington, D.C., which states (Saudi Publications on Hate Ideology Fill American Mosques):

â€œAmong the more significant illustrations of imitating (the unbelievers), and the most dangerous for Muslims, is the enchantment of women. And this is among the traits of the unbelievers. The intent of this is to bring (them) out of their nature, veil, and modesty so that they could use it to tempt menâ€¦. Because women desire the glamour of the materialistic life, they are inclined to imitate, accommodate, and exaggerate in all of this, because women were built to seduce and beautify themselves for men. And men were built to desire a woman when she exposes (herself), and not to desire her when she is modest and covering.â€ [Document No. 47] The book adds that, if Muslim women unveil themselves, the whole Muslim community will be in peril:

â€œIf they (Muslim women) leave the principle of modesty and cover, this will be the road and the way to discord (fitna), and in most cases if the Muslim nation falls into this trend it will lose its religion and worldly life.â€ [Document No. 47]

Australiaâ€™s most senior Muslim cleric, Sheik Hilali in a religious address on adultery to about 500 worshippers in Sydney said:

“If you take out uncovered meat and place it outside on the street, or in the garden or in the park, or in the backyard without a cover, and the cats come and eat it … whose fault is it, the cats or the uncovered meat?

“The uncovered meat is the problem. If she was in her room, in her home, in her hijab, no problem would have occurred.”

He said women were “weapons” used by “Satan” to control men.

“It is said in the state of zina (adultery), the responsibility falls 90 per cent of the time on the woman. Why? Because she possesses the weapon of enticement (igraa).”

A lot of Australian Muslims were outraged by his remarks. (The Australian 10/26/06). Robert Spencer wrote in Frontpagemagazine that:

It was also somewhat surprising that Al-Hilaliâ€™s remarks generated any uproar at all. After all, the idea that a woman is responsible if she is raped did not originate with him, and this was not the first time it has been enunciated in the West. One notorious example occurred in September 2004 in Denmark, when the mufti Shahid Mehdi of the Islamic Cultural Center in Copenhagen said on the Danish television program Talk to Gode that women who venture outside without a hijab are â€œasking for rape.â€
Sandesh on October 30, 2007 5:45 pm
This is really disgusting to hear such new. People in power can do anything and get away with it. Indian people have short memory “they forget things untill it happens to themself”.
I want Rizwanur to get justice if that exist in India for a normal genuine person who don’t have Political contacts, money and power. He paid a price for loving a rich businessmen’s daughter, who deserve to get punished for his evil deed.

Support him, as his last desire was: Don’t forget Awaz Uthana……………
Jawaid Ahsan on October 31, 2007 2:20 am
This is just a reply to Ms Firdaus’ post. She has tried to completely divert the main topic here and she seems to me as one of those ‘bhatak gaye log’. God bless her !! My this post is just a reply to her’s (Ms Firdaus, please read this carefully) and I would request everybody to please dont refrain from the main topic after this. The main topic is about humanity and justice, and not about religions. This is a letter written by a mother to her daughter Tahira..

Women Role In Islam :-
:: Status of Men and Women

Woman under The Prevalent Laws

Tahira (women), in your mind you have quite easily concluded that since the “Sharia Laws” (Religious Laws) have been formulated by men, they give them an upper hand and tend to suppress women. There is no doubt that our prevalent ”Sharia Laws” would result in the same mess. However, the reason is not as you have understood it. If we consider your reason to be correct, then men ‘by nature’ are such that they want an upper hand and want to overpower and enslave women. If you remember, I had analyzed this fact in a letter to Saleem, that there is no such thing as ‘human nature’. What we call ‘Nature’ consists of something that he has brought along from his animal life. As far as animals are concerned, you never see a male keeping an upper hand over his female. As such, men cannot have this streak because of their animal instincts. Besides animal instincts, the qualities that manifest in ‘human nature’ are in fact the result of heredity, circumstances, education and nurturing. Therefore, it would be incorrect to claim that because our ”Sharia Laws” have been made by men, they have given women a degraded position in them. Instead, it would be more appropriate to say that these laws had been formulated under such circumstances when tyranny, instead of justice, was the order of the day.

At that time, the ‘woman’ was hated. Hence, according to these laws and ideas, a woman’s status was that of a down-trodden, enslaved and degraded being. These laws relate to our monarchical period and, as I have often repeated before, our prevalent ‘Islam’, too, was more or less formulated at that time. Life in this period, whether it concerned men or women had coercion as its prominent feature. For example, all the laws formulated at that time reserved all the rights for the ruling class. The ruled had no rights; they could only beg for the royal benevolence. They could not demand anything as of right. According to these laws, the landlord had all the rights, and the tiller of the land was treated as a servant. According to these rules a rich man could get all the luxuries whenever he wanted, and the poor received even their daily bread as a charity. In fact the poor got something, too, but this was only to save the giver from the influence of the evil eye. So much so that according to these beliefs, a rich man could buy his paradise with his money, but a poor man had to cry and beg for his salvation.It is so obvious, therefore, that in an environment where such laws and beliefs have been devised even for male subordinates, a woman cannot expect better treatment.

Women and Quran

All of these, dear daughter Tahira (woman), were the results of the above mentioned laws and moral codes, which were the product of times mentioned above. However, the Muslim criteria of fixing the status of a woman, or man, are neither these social laws nor this moral code. For the Muslims, there is only one standard under the sky, and that is the book of God, which they profess to believe in. What status does the Quran endows for woman? The details are lengthy, but their gist reminds me of a joke which Allama Iqbal used to relate. He would say, “If I were not a Muslim, and I had studied the Quran like an ordinary student, then I would have concluded that this book was written by a woman, who was taking revenge on man, for the usurped rights of her community”. If one studies the religions and cultures of the world, it leaves no doubt in one’s mind that a woman has been pushed to extreme degradation. On the other hand, in the Quranic study it appears as if she has been favoured very much. For a start, the Quran has rejected the common belief that God created man (Adam) first and then woman (Eve) was created out of his rib. By now, you must have understood that according to the Quran, this very concept that human beings were created by a special couple called Adam and Eve, is wrong. The Quran, in effect, presents Adam as the representative of mankind or humanity.

-:Birth of a Human

The theory of evolution tells us that life began with a single cell that later divided itself into two i.e. an ovum and a spermatozoon. The Quran corroborates the same by saying: God created you from a single life cell and from it created its mate (for man a woman and for woman a man) and from them twain (4:1). In other words the single life cell swelled and divided itself into two and this continued until then a great number of men and women inhabited this world. And from them were created many men and women (4:1). You should note that the Quran does not discriminate between men and women by virtue of their genders. Their life source is the same, and they are like two branches of the same origin.

-:Zauj (One of a Pair)

The Quran calls both man and woman as Zauj; but in Urdu we call a woman the Zauja of a man. We do not call a man the Zauj of a woman. The Quran, however, calls both man and woman, Zauj to each other, meaning companions. Further, it does not say that the woman is a man’s Zauj, and that the man is not. God addresses human beings and tells them: He has made Zauj among you (30:21, 42:11). Zauj means a friend and companion; which implies that men and women are each other’s friends and companions. Accordingly, Zauj would mean the ones who are complementary to each other. Given this meaning, a man complements a woman, and a woman complements a man. They are Zauj to each other. The Quran has gone to the extent of saying, you are from each other (3:195). Therefore, no individual can call itself complete unilaterally.

After this, the Quran has negated the myth that ‘Adam had faltered in the paradise due to a woman’. The belief of Satan trapping the woman and then the woman tempting Adam, who sinned and was then kicked out of paradise was rejected as has been mentioned in Torah of Jews. The Quran says that both man and woman are capable of compliance or defiance of laws; both can err and commit mistakes. Therefore, it said: Satan misguided both of them (2:36). Hence it is wrong to surmise that woman is responsible for all the sins committed in this world, and that the man is completely innocent.

-:Both Man and Woman are Respectable

Having seen the negative stance, let us explore the positive angle. The Quran ordains: Verily We have made humankind worthy of respect (17:70). This reference is not only for man, but for woman also. In the norms of the Arabic language when one wants to mention both men and women together, would say “Bani so and so”. In the Quran, “Bani Israel” does not mean only men of Israel, but both men and women. Similarly when the Quran tells us: We created humans with aesthetic balance (95:4), this includes both men and women. The Quran always collectively addresses human beings, and not just men.

-: The Quranic Aim

By the way this point should make you understand the aim of the Quran, viz.:

(i) To develop human potentialities and to harmonize them in a balanced way. (Balance here means the appropriate and proper weight. Whatever weight anything is supposed to have, it should have just that. Everyone knows the importance of the exact or the correct weight of an ingredient in a doctor’s prescription;)

(ii) The society in which people have to deal with each other should be balanced;

(iii) Humans and the forces of nature should also strike a harmonious balance.

In other words, the purpose of human life is to establish a balance. Now, when in the Quran human life refers to both men and women, is it possible that we can achieve this balance with only one gender (either men or women alone)? Can you imagine maintaining this balance by ignoring half of humanity altogether? A basic reason for all the imbalances in human life is the consideration of half of humanity as a whole. This deprives us of the benefits of a balanced way of life, as in general it remains incomplete. This ignorance goes a step further. The half (which man considers as being human), has been further divided and sub divided to such an extent, that the very self of ninety-nine percent of humans has been discriminated against. Only those who belong to the “upper strata”, according to their self-made norms, are considered humans. This is irrespective of any bias towards intellectuals like Plato, or to any religious leader. Every where you see the division and distinction of classes is prevalent. (But this subject does not fall into the inquiry your have made, so I shall not talk about it in detail in this letter.)

Women Individual Qualities

As I have mentioned above, men and women have many qualities which are common to both of them, for example intellect and insight. Those aspects of life in which both have common qualities would work side by side. By virtue of the division of labour, mentioned before, a woman has been biologically endowed with the capability of giving birth and raising a child. This a man lacks. This female capability fulfils a basic need of the society, and thus compensates for man’s great drawback. In this respect a woman is far superior to a man. A mother’s lap is the first training ground of a child. The child would be what his mother makes him; and the entire nation would be influenced by this upbringing. That is why in the Arabic language (and in the Quran itself) the nation is named as ‘Ummah’. The root of this word is ‘Um’, which means mother. Therefore, according to the Quran, a mother is responsible for building and moulding a nation. This is the one quality of woman, which man is deprived of. Just think of how colossal a burden of responsibility a woman carries, and how exalted her status is! A woman spends most of her life dealing with these responsibilities, and during that time she may be unable to participate in those activities which require effort and hard physical work. This role in society is fulfilled by man. He spends and uses all his time to exploit and develop the sources of nourishment. (This is what is known as earning the daily bread). It is, however, obvious that this cannot give man an upper hand over a woman. A woman supplements one of his deficiencies and he covers for one of hers. In other words the woman is productive or procures in one way, and man in another. One is superior in one aspect, the other is superior in another. God has made you superior to one another (due to having different qualities) (2:34).

The Quran reveals that it is because of your self-made standards that you believe that since man earns and spends his earnings on the woman, he is better being. (If one accepts the principle that the earners are better than the spenders, then the farmers should be considered better than the thinkers, philosophers and inventors; and the soldiers fighting in a war should be much lower than the labourers, because thinkers, philosophers and soldiers do not till the land and produce food). You have stretched this self-made criterion to such an extent, that a woman has started questioning as to why she was made a female, and not a man. The society that the Quran envisages can never raise such questions in a woman’s mind. That is why God has said: On the basis of whatever qualities you have been endowed with by God, you cannot discriminate against the other sex in such a manner, that the other one yearns for the same (4:32).

Men and women have different qualities depending upon their individual fields of work. The question remains whether both do their duties in the most conscientious and dedicated manner. Those who work diligently and wholeheartedly in their respective sphere of activities will reap the benefits in the society. You should only wish for being able to do your best in your respective fields (4:32).

-: Common Capabilities

Aside from this division of labour, the remaining human capabilities belong to both men and women. Surah Al-Ahzab mentions all these capabilities, which can be attributed to both men and women:

If men have the potentiality to develop their personality by harmonizing themselves with the Laws of Allah, then women also have a similar potentiality; if men can be members of a movement that aims at world peace according to the inviolable Laws of Allah, then women also can participate in it by becoming its members; if men can restrain their capabilities so as to develop them within the laws of Allah, so can women; if men can vindicate the truth of their conviction through its practical implementation in life, so can women vindicate it; if men can remain steadfast on the path they have chosen, so can women; if men have the inexhaustible capacity to be more and more in harmony with the Laws of Allah Almighty once they are set on this path, so have women this inexhaustible capacity; if men can sacrifice lower values for higher values, so can women; if men can exercise control and do not violate the limitations set on them, so can women; if men can keep their sexual urge within the desired limits, so can women; if men can understand the Laws of Allah Almighty and focus their activities in life on them, so can women. Now if both men and women have equal capacities and potentialities, their results should also be the same for both of them. Hence both will enjoy protection and security, and all other such benefits and joy that will come out of their deeds (33:35).

Tahira, look at all these Quranic details and think! Is there any aspect of life for which it has said that man has a particular quality which the woman does not; that man can do this and a woman cannot; or that man can become this, and a woman cannot? That is why the Quran tells us, in clear terms:

The positive actions of both men and women would bring them satisfying results; both would experience heaven side by side; it will be the heaven of their home, of this world and in continuity of this life, the heaven of the hereafter (4:124). Nobody’s toils would be wasted. (3:195).

You have seen Tahira, that according to the Quran:

(i) Both men and women have been endowed with all the human qualities. The objective of life is to develop all these qualities, and to use them most appropriately. Therefore on this account, there is no distinction between men or women. Both are entitled to ‘enter paradise’. As such, there is no reason why one sex should be distinguished from the other.

(ii) However, due to the universal law of division of labour, there are certain duties that only a woman can fulfil. In this respect a woman compensates for one of man’s great deficiency in society. But as a woman has to spend a great deal of her life fulfilling the call of these duties, she cannot earn her living. A man is thus called upon to fulfil this deficiency of the society. However, just as a woman cannot have an upper hand because she is fulfilling those duties which are impossible for a man to perform, in the same manner a man, too, cannot subjugate a woman by claiming that throughout most of her life she is incapable of earning her living.

(iii) Society’s balance can be maintained only if all people perform their respective duties to the best of their abilities.

(iv) In this respect the life gets divided into two spheres. One encircles the duties of a woman only, and the other encompasses duties in which both men and women can participate together.

(v) Just as it would be wrong for a woman not to perform the duties exclusively assigned to her, in the same manner it would also be wrong to confine to her particular circle and to prohibit her from entering the mutual enclosure. Both such actions can cause the disruption of the society.

Women Evidence

The second point is about evidence. Surah Al-Baqarah enjoins upon us that whenever you deal in loans, you should state it in writing and have two men to witness it. Further on it says: If you do not have two men, then make a man and two women as witnesses. The Quran itself explains why should there be two women. It is commonly understood that the verse means: if one of them forgets, then the other one reminds her (2:282). But the Quran has used the word “Tadilla” which is quite different from forgetting. Basically it means to get confused or become perplexed. Given this explanation for the word, let us come to the actual verse. This verse raises these questions:

(i) Why does it necessitate two women in place of one man?

(ii) Why has it been said, particularly about women, that if one is perplexed then the other would remind her?

From this it is commonly concluded that the Quran feels the women are less trustworthy and that their mental capability is less than that of men. For trustworthiness, the Quran enjoins the condition of two even for men. Would you conclude this that the Quran does not also trust men? Was it for this that one man was not considered enough! Was another one considered necessary for evidence? It is obvious that the Quran does not mistrust one man. The only purpose, according to the Quran of having two men as witnesses is that if there is anything lacking in the statement of one, then the testimony of the other one would complement it. This is only to forestall any legal omission. The purpose is not to brand men untrustworthy. The purpose is to have absolutely reliable evidence, without any omissions. In the same way when the Quran makes it necessary for two women in place of one man, it is not telling us that women are any less trustworthy than men. Here, too, the aim is to have the most reliable evidence. Otherwise, as far as the comparative trust among men and women is concerned, the Quran gives both an equal status. For example where evidence in law has been mentioned, the testimony of one woman is just as acceptable as that of one man.

Now we are left with the second question as to why did the Quran specifically remark about women, that if one of them is confused or perplexed then the other should remind her? Clearly according to the division of labour (which, as I have mentioned in my letter, refers to the duty of women towards bringing up and nurturing children and of men to earn the family’s livelihood), some differences between biological constitution of men and women were necessary.

-:Women Share in Inheritance

Regarding inheritance, the Quran tells us that the share of one boy is equal to that of two girls (4:11). As I have mentioned in my previous letter, the Quran establishes a society in which men are the main earners, because the duties and responsibilities assigned to the women do not leave them with enough time to earn their own living. It is thus obvious that in a society in which the man is responsible for earning livelihood, he should get a larger portion when making an economic division. That is why, in inheritance, a boy’s share has been kept double that of a girl. Girls have not been made responsible for their own, or their family’s expenses. On the contrary, a boy has to bear his own expenses in addition to those expenses of his wife and children. As such, he should be getting the greater share.

On the other hand, in a situation in which men are neglecting their duties and it is feared that the girls would be rendered destitute, then the Quran gives authority that, in a will, a person can divide his property as he pleases and according to the circumstances. The division of inheritance as given in the Quran is only applicable if a person dies without executing a will, or if his will does not include all his property. The Quran is quite clear about this. As you can see, the fixing of a lesser share for a girl neither lessens her rights nor degrades her status in the society, when compared to that of a man.

Psychological difference Between Men and Women

This difference is quite natural. Since physical characteristics do influence a person’s psyche, men and women necessarily have psychological differences. In this respect, one resulting effect, which is quite clear is that, a man, after bringing income, is satisfied that he has done his duty towards bringing up his children. The woman, on other hand, is never satisfied that she has done enough, even after sacrificing all she has on her children. She wants to put in even the last reserve of her energy into caring for her child. If it were possible, she would physically keep her child in her heart. The hugging of the child to her bosom is the subconscious manifestation of this emotion. You have noticed that every woman in this world carries her child on her left arm. Why? It is because she wants to keep her child close to her heart, which is on the left side. What are the consequences of these psychological or biological differences between men and women? Many western scholars of psychology have done, and are doing research on this subject. Dr. M. Esther Harding has written an interesting book on this subject, called “The Way of All Women”. In it he has written about the point we are considering:

If the men are asked to work where problems of human relationship are involved, they do not find it palatable, but the women on the other hand love such jobs. The women find it difficult, where they are required to define details of a problem with absolute accuracy. (Page 301).

Why does this happen? Nothing conclusively could be said about it, but Dr. Harding states that this is an ability which he has found generally common among the women he has tested in many practical examples.

If this research is correct, then you can appreciate how much the Quran has taken care of this issue. In the courts, the details of a case are normally argued, commented, discussed and questioned in a very critical manner. If the details of the case are not presented absolutely accurately, then this also affects the evidence in the case. To corroborate evidence, it is necessary that even the minutest differences are defined correctly. Women might have that psychological deficiency which has been mentioned above, and moreover by being busy with their particular duties, they may not have enough opportunities, as compared to men, to participate in such activities or problems. As a result, matters of dispute such as court cases where serious matters are discussed, a woman in general would not be able to explain the details correctly. The Quran has described the same phenomenon at a different place and in another manner. Surah Al-Zukhruf states that the Arabs used to believe that God had daughters. They used to say that their angels and deities were God’s daughters. The Quran replied, (let alone the belief of God having children is absolutely ridiculous). Look at the dilemma, that even for off-springs they allocate sons to themselves and girls are attributed to God. They devalue a girl so much, that if a man hears the ‘good news’ of the birth of a daughter, he becomes sad and then says that it is God’s child.

Those who have been brought up with a silver spoon and in jewels, in matters of dispute they are not very clear about their mind. (43:18).

To become perplexed in disputed matters, specially court cases, is the same that has been mentioned in Surah Al-Baqarah by the word “Tadhal” (mental confusion) By now you must have understood that two women in place of one man does not mean that women cannot be trusted, or that they are less brainy, or that they are given any privilege to rule women.

According to Dr. Harding’s research, if women fall behind in issues concerning accurate details, the men are lacking in matters of public relationship. If one is deficient in one aspect, the other is deficient in another. Mutual cooperation can fulfil all the deficiencies in a society.

It should be made quite clear that the Quran talks in general terms and does not discuss the exceptions. It is not meant that proper education and training cannot make up for the deficiency in a person. The heavenly or ideal society professes that: a woman will have a flair for oratory and languages (56:37). Further to these explanations, it is to be noted that in respect of the two women, the Quran does not say that both of them are to give evidence one after the other, thereby making their testimony equal to that of one man. It says: if the one who is presenting evidence is uncertain due to some confusion, then the one standing by her should remind her (2:282). This makes it obvious that if the woman recording the evidence is not confused then any prompting by the other would not occur, and the testimony of a lone woman would be enough.

It is also evident that if girls are not adorned by jewels only that they would not be at a loss when problems in life are to be tackled; but when they are adorned with the jewels of education and proper training, they would be quite eloquent. In this case no standby woman would be needed for evidence. The Quran’s laws in such matters are specifically conditional. When these conditions are not fulfilled, the laws do not remain operative. For example, if you do find water, then the law of dry ablutions becomes spurious.

This is all regarding this matter, as I have been able to understand from the Quran. As I have already mentioned in my letter, the different aspects of the relation between men and women * , and their position in the society, are in front of me, and you will see them gradually in my forthcoming letters.
RAVI PILLAY on October 31, 2007 3:33 pm
ha ha ha ha ha ha

good that he died

WHAT FUTURE THIS BANGLADESHI SHI* HAD……????

HE LIVED IN TILJALA ……… ISLAMIC HELL HOLE IN CENTRAL KOLKATTA

HE HAD NO GOOD JOB …….EVERYONE IS NOWADAYS A GRAPIC DESIGNER…..

WHAT FUTURE HE HAD WITH A MUSLIM GIRL ……???

WHAT BETTER THAN MARRYING A RICH MARWARI GIRL IN NAME OF ROMANCE ….??

HE BETRAYED THE TRUST REPOSED BY PARENTS IN THE GURU PARAMPARA…. REMEMBER IN MAHABHARATA …. ARJUN REFUSED TO MARRY UTTARA WHEN SHE CAME TO KNOW “BRINAHALLA” WAS THE GREAT ARJUN …… AND ARJUN OFFER MARRIAGE HER TO HIS SON PARIKSHIT…

HE HAS BREACHED THE TRUST REPOSED IN HIM …

GOOD RIDDANCE AND MAY HE ROT IN HELL
TAUFIQ on November 1, 2007 3:42 pm
pat,

do your homework first and then speak you IDIOT no muslim will ever oppose singing “sare jaha se accha hindustan hamara” because it was sung and written by allahma iqbal it is vande mataram that we oppose becasue we never bow to anyone besides allah that does not put a question mark on our patriotisum you guys just shout about it your are like all fart and no shit
TAUFIQ on November 1, 2007 4:27 pm
firdaus

i feel sorry for you that you had such a bad experience with your father or whoever else it might be and that you have such negative thoughts about islam. but think if you were right then islam is the fastest growing religion in the world and especially in the west and that too in western women so think about the grudges that you have against islam with a different angle and with a more balanced prespective.
i just want to draw your attention to the current statistics and then think a bit more wisely and then arrive at the conclusion.
i hope you start liking the wonderfull religion again.
paithanker on November 1, 2007 6:30 pm
firdous i am very sorry to hear about your religious views.you are an ubfortunate girl on the earth.it was the blessings of allah swt that you were born to a muslim parents,and you are now under the command of shaitan.there is no difference in between you and taslima nasreen the writer of bangla desh.you are munafiq now.i urge you to ask forgiveness of allah swt and renew your creed by accepting shahada.
Robin on November 1, 2007 7:44 pm
Anti nationals and terrorists deserve a death in boiling lard. People who consider religion and god above humanity also deserve the same.
Jawaid Ahsan on November 2, 2007 3:32 am
I completely agree with Mr Robin. And as far as my information is concerned, there is certainly NO religion existing on earth which does not teach its followers ‘Humanity’. If u believe in the religion, u will surely believe the God also, and if u believe both religion and God honestly, u will certainly respect its teachings which includes ‘Humanity’. So, to have complete faith in ur religion, u have to have faith in humanity as well. These all are inter-related, nothing is separable. One simply cant follow one and ignore the other.
Life…is elsewhere, not here: Rizwanur Rehman « Love’s Ragpicker on November 2, 2007 4:11 am
[...] that he had married a Hindu girl, daughter of a rich industrialist called Ashok Todi. You can read here how police negotiated with Rizwanur to send his wife back to nurse her so-called ill father. And [...]
Firdaus on November 2, 2007 11:17 am
Islam and Women

Dr. Younus Shaikh

Dr. Younus Shaikh, Pakistani Rationalist and founder President of the Rationalist organization of Pakistan, “The Enlightenment”, who was once sentenced to death for blasphemy in Pakistan, writes on Islam and Women.

I

Dr. Younus Shaikh
Before the advent of Islam, the pagan Arab women generally enjoyed a respectable status in society; many of them including Khadija - the first wife of the prophet of Islam, had the right to engage in business and choose or dismiss their husbands in a matrilineal fashion; they took part in most activities of war and peace including public worship. In female oriented Arab paganism, goddesses had special status; in Mecca, the female goddess Al-Uzza, in Taif the goddess Al-Lat and in Medina the goddess Manat were the most popular deities, and their statues were most revered while the statue of the stern Allah was almost neglected.

Arab pagan poetry was mostly concerned with the beauty and grace of their women, and the glory of their tribal values in peace and war. And it was only in one predator tribe of Mecca that the evil custom of burying alive of the daughters prevailed. It was highly unusual for a man of pre-Islamic Arab society to have more than one wife in his house; and it is quite certain that polygamy was introduced and encouraged by the prophet after the revelation of Islam. Women were to produce as many Muslims as possible. This ultimately resulted in the degradation in the status of the married woman in the Islamic society. Whereas the pre-Islamic Arab custom allowed many looser forms of marriage on the matrilineal and matri-local tradition that gave the woman freedom and liberty as full human being, however the artificial rules of Islamic nikah reduced marriage to mere sexual and social slavery.

The prophet of Islam, before prophethood, opposed the burying alive of the newborn daughters; he was eager to work for a woman and gladly married a divorced woman. The early Islam continued with most of the pre-Islam tribal traditions; there were no hijabs or veils for women of Madina; and at a later date only the nine wives of prophets were restricted in their social intercourse as their home was constantly full of visitors. However the prophet’s women sex-slaves were not restricted in any such manners.

Indeed, the semi-transparent half-face- veil (hijab) was actually a very old custom originating in the Assyrian times, a status symbol and a mark of social distinction for the free women. The pre-Islamic pagan Arab woman of the cities often wore the fashionable semi-transparent half-face veil but the tribal women never did.

Later, Islam added measures for “the preservation of modesty for women” -like casting down their eyes in public, concealing their breasts and jewellery and the likes. However, these restrictions were later extended by the followers of the prophet far beyond his original intentions as expressed in Koran, and remained more or less a permanent fixture of Muslim life thereafter.

Later on, however, the insecurity of early Islam gradually added to the exclusion of women, and 100 years later, by the reign of the Abbasid Caliph Haroon ur Rashid, women became merely sexual toys and breeding machines; and as married women they were merely maid servants- mere man’s social appendages. Moreover, as female sex-slaves, women were freely bought and sold in open markets of all Islamic countries, and loaned, rented or bestowed as gifts to friends. The prophet himself bestowed women sex-slaves to his favourites. There was no limit to the number of slaves one could own; one of the companions of prophet Hazrat Zubair Ibn ul Arvan, for example, had 1000 men-slaves and 1000 women sex-slaves. Islam took the woman as the land tilled by the man where he spilled his seeds.

The prophet himself took part or guided nearly 100 wars or raids or attacks for plunder. After him, his followers continued the offence. The fierce Islamic tribal Bedouins with centuries long experience of ruthless and cruel tribal warfare proved to be the worthwhile shock troops of Islam. After Iraq, Syria fell to the Islamic Empire in 634 CE. Despite surrenders, great massacres took place at many places; thousands of men were slaughtered and women and children sold into slavery; monasteries were ransacked, monks and villagers were slain and nuns were raped. After the conquest of Egypt, many of its towns were put to sword and their entire population wiped out. Great massacres also occurred in Cyprus and North Africa. The Roman province of Iraq, the Syrian province of Iran, and the conquered Iran brought hundreds of thousands of men-slaves, women sex-slaves, and the vast fertile lands of these once mighty and civilized countries where the women had been held in high respect e.g. the Manichaecian Iraq, the Pharonic Egypt and North African Civilizations.

As in Egypt and Iran, wherever the conquering Islamic Bedouins armies went, they destroyed the local civilization’s cultures, imposed their Islamic tribal medievalism recklessly murdering men and degrading women to perpetual sexual slavery. In short, the Islamic tribal Bedouins and barbarians did the same to the surrounding higher civilizations what the Roman barbarians did to the highly civilized ancient Greeks. Meanwhile the Islamic Bedouins continued to raid and abduct the European women for Islamic slave markets during all these Islamic centuries. The conquest of Syria forced the conversion of thousands of Christian priests to Islam, who changed their religion but not their profession: they became the stern anti-feminine Islamic mullahs and not only continued their religious magic and rituals but also continued the essentially Christian medievalism under Islam.

In short, as a result of these conquests, destructions and imposition of Islamic tribal medievalism, societies under the Islamic Empire went further than any other in their total exclusion of women from political power and social influence. Islamic legislation went far beyond anything the prophet had originally dreamed of in his tribal religiosity in cheating women of their rightful place in society and in matters of inheritance. Where originally the Koran gave women the right of inheritance, the Islamic mullah invented the legalized institution of Waqf- the religious foundation, to exclude the daughters and their descendents from inheritance. Though the Koran does give the right of inheritance to women, she continued to be a minor; usually uneducated needing a guardian in father, husband or the son. Indeed, the status of women in Islam is theoretically exalted but utterly deplorable in practice.

Multiplying number of harems (residing place for the female sex-slaves), finally institutionalised under Caliph Al-Walid II, emphasized the inevitable degradation of womanhood under Islam. Haroon ur Rashid, the Islamic Caliph (ruler) had 2000 female sex-slaves, Caliph Mutwakkal had 4000 female sex-slaves; and every mullah, official or soldier of Islamic state had some men-slaves and women sex-slaves belonging to the conquered civilization nations. Not being allowed to learn, experience or think for herself, it is no wonder that there are hardly very few outstanding women in 1600 years of Islamic history, and those who by chance or by the force of the ancient pre-Islamic customs came into light or in the corridors of power were sooner or later eliminated on the orders of some pious and religious Islamic mullah.. Indeed, Islam’s violent anti-feminism have been as nefarious as Christianity’s burning of hundreds of thousands European women as witches in 15th, 16th and 17th century. The female hating instruments of the Islamic Empire, the mullahs and the Caliphs, continued to promote degradation of women under the formal and sordid Islamic legal code of Shariah, the final seal on the complete subjection of the female element.. The modern history of Islam is merely the continuation of the Islamic tribal medievalism, only the technology , phraseology and the faÃ§ade is modern.

II

“Indian sub-continent suffered the humiliation and destruction under Islam, as did Africa. The Islamic General Mohammad Bin Qasim decimated great Buddhist and Hindu civilizations. Acting on the orders of a representative of the Islamic Caliph, Governor Hijaj Bin Yousaf (who was a deadly enemy of the Hazrat Ali and Hazrat Hussein’s family-some of whom have taken refuge under the Buddhist monarch Raja Dahir in Sindh), Mohammad Bin Qasim conquered the kingdom in 712 CE. His Islamic plunderers and looters demolished temples, shattered sculptures, plundered palaces and killed thousands. It took his Islamic army three days to slaughter the inhabitants of Debal, their women and children were taken into slavery. Later on he pardoned many prisoners and tried to establish a just rule of law which enraged the very Islamic and murderous Governor Hijaj Bin Yousaf; therefore Qasim again reverted to the Islamic barbarity and massacred between 6-16 thousands in Brahiminabad, their women and children were sent to Arab Islamic slave markets.

This was the beginning of the destruction of the classical ancient Indian civilization, and start of the medieval age of Islamic darkness in India. The 11th century witnessed another Islamic murderer and plunderer, Sultan Mahmud Ghaznavi an agent of Islamic Caliph, who utterly ruined the great Indian civilization and looted and plundered most of its wealth. Fifty thousand Hindus were massacred in just one of his attacks at Somnath; he invaded India more than 17 times. Thousands of Hindu men and women were sent to the Islamic Afghani slave markets. The highly cultured and civilized daughters of the noble Hindu families were sold to the illiterate, un-cultured and barbaric Afghanis for equivalent of just one Frank (Pound/Dollar) each. After every Afghani Muslim had four wives each, there were lots of surplus women left; to that the evil Islamic mullahs responded with an ingenious translation of Koranic verses proving that Allah allowed each Muslim to marry 18 women at a time along with an unlimited number of women as concubines. Soon the new military instruments of the Islamic Caliph, the Turks and the Moguls followed, decimated captured Delhi and turned whole of India into a grand open-air slave camp. Sultan Firoze Shah Tughlaq- an Islamic Turk ruler had 100,000 men-slaves and thousands of female sex-slaves in his harem; the pious Islamic Mongol (Mogul) Emperor Shahjehan had 15,000 female sex-slaves and concubines for his personal harem. Indeed, the Islamic Turk invaders and rulers did the same in India as they did in Armenia-the whole races of peoples were exterminated. (However, credit must be given here to the agnostic and secular-minded, humanist Mogul Emperor Akbar the Great who refused the title of “the King of Muslims” and preferred to be called “the shadow of God”- for his God, he declared (in accordance with the mind and language of his age), is the beneficial deity and protector of all-Hindus, Muslims and other races of humans and creatures alike. He gave up his faith in Islam and tried his genius in creating a pluralistic religion comprising traditions of all the prevalent religions and ideologies of India. He even invited the Christian Jesuits priests from Goa to his ideology-discussion-palace but could not swallow their childish Jesus-son-of-God myth).

The medieval Islamic Empire of the Turkish Osmania Caliphate disappeared after Axis defeat in the World War I and with the rise of the Turkish secular hero Mustafa Kemal Pasha. However, it soon metamorphosed into the modern Saudi Islamic spiritual Empire. It is noteworthy that while the very Christian Holy Roman British Empire of the West required standing armies to control the bodies of men in all its colonies, the theocratic Saudi Islamic spiritual Empire of the East depended on the standing army of clerics-Mullahs and Imams-stationed in mosques to control the minds of men-the social, cultural spiritual and psychological control. It is true that Islam dismantled the old Arab tribal loyalties and some of its taboos and traditions; however it created a new tribe in the name of Islam with prophet himself as its chieftain and his family and tribe-Hashmis and Quresh acquiring an elevated and sacred status- a replacement of old medieval tribe with a new theocratic tribe. However, it essentially continued many of the ancient pagan rituals of worship as well as many of its old taboos and traditions. The tribal blood loyalties were replaced with the new tribal religious loyalties. At intellectual level Islam is merely the continuation of the medieval Jahiliya (Ignorance) in the holy garb of Islam- the Islamic Jahilia (the Islamic Medieval Ignorance). Modern Islam is, indeed, merely a continuation of that medieval tribal ignorance and mental backwardness.

Since the advent of the Saudi oil, petrodollars started to support the Islamic extremist movements all over the world and continue to do so. The Saudi petrodollars have created thousands of Islamic centres for social and political control and propaganda- the mosques-all over the world; 1000 mosques were built in the USA only in just last few years. Islamic brainwashing and political propaganda continues in these mosques and madrassas-the religious schools, as well as through the Islamic newspapers, magazines, radios and televisions. All kind of extremist Islamic terrorism and fundamentalism emanates and flows from the ” Kernel of Evil- the Epicentre of the ugly Islamism-the Saudis”. For Allah of the Saudis makes submission to Islam obligatory for all humans. Those who refuse their submission to Allah or differ from the Saudi version of Islam are called the Satan’s party, and must be eliminated by Saudis or their paid and brainwashed zombies-the Muslims- called the Allah’s party. Saudi Arabia is in fact the worst example of Islamic medievalism, and mental, social backwardness. Slavery was legal in Saudi until 1960s when it was officially abolished on the personal request of the non-Muslim US President J F Kennedy! However, it continues in new names: the foreign female domestic servants-the private property of the Islamic Bedouin barbarians. Saudi petrodollars continue to support the extremist and fundamentalist mullahs, and continue to lure the Islamic states into the barbarity of the Islamic medieval Shariah laws, and the Saudis continue to spread Islamic mullah terrorism and Islamic theocratic totalitarianism all over the world.”

Iran basically an Islamic spiritual colony, is the godfather of the Shiite Islamic terrorism,( Saudi Sunnis are an Islamic sect like the Christian Catholics while Shiites are like the Protestant Christians). This Allah’s government in Iran is the most evil religious state today. Torture, murder and Islamic absolutism- an Islamic version of Hitler’s Nazism, Stalin’s Communism and Mussolini’s Fascism combined. There were 5,195 political and religious executions only in 1983 alone! Few years ago a bill was presented in Iranian Parliament asking that in according with the tradition of Islamic prophet, marriage should be allowed with 9 years old girl child! Human rights are definitely not allowed to exist in the Islamic Iran, where according to the English language Radio Iran, the Holy Spirit of imam Khomeni hovers over Iran all the times. Women have been hanged on suspicion of sexual crimes. Even proved virgins have been sent to gallows, however, they are hanged only after being raped, as Iranian Islam does not allow hanging of virgins. Iran had used its oil money in the interest of Islamic revolutions all over the world, and continues to do so.

Algeria, known for its Islamic civil war continues with its Islamic horrors. Islamic absolutism and totalitarianism is imposed with guns and slaughters in the interest of religion of Islam. Men are usually killed for their religio-political crimes while women are killed just for the crime of being a woman in an Islamic country. Thousands were islamically raped and more than 500 were killed only in 1993. Women have been killed for not wearing hijab (veil) or refusing to do so when imposed, for refusing to engage in Iranian-style temporary marriage, for being married to foreign men, and for working and living alone. The victims have been as young as 9 years and as old as 69 years. Women are often raped and tortured before being slaughtered. Thousands find themselves imprisoned in Islamic camps for no legitimate reasons. It is worth mentioning that women had a respectable status in society before the conquest of Algeria by Islam.

Egyptians, heir to the great Pharonic and Alexandrian civilizations continue to suffer the chronic evil of Islam. Known for the miseries of hijab and female genital mutilation, Egypt is also a centre of child prostitution for the wealthy Saudi Islamic Bedouins. In Egypt, four out of five women are forced to wear some kind of hijab. Female genital mutilation is very common; up to 73% in Cairo and 95% in rural areas. In 1995 a shaikh (religious dignity) of Al-Azhar University Cairo issued a fatwa (the religious decree or bill), which reportedly announced the procedure pf Female Genital Mutilation as “laudable practice that does honour to women”; and stating that it was, a religious duty as important as praying to Allah.

Sudan had a long history of Islamic conquest and repression. Islamic totalitarianism and barbarity continues to this day. Recently, Sudan was brutalized by the Saudi-backed Gen.Numeri’s Islamic fascism. In 1992 a religious decree-fatwa-was issued that gave justification to the military onslaught against the non-Muslims. Islamic barbarism and genocide continues in Darfur to this day.

Indonesian Islamic army mass-murdered 200,000 East Timurian non-Muslims before East Timur got its independent. The country is known for its extreme religiosity, corruption, ethno-religious problems and Islamic extremism.

Pakistan, an experimental laboratory of Islam, had turned into a horror. Notwithstanding the hundreds of thousands of rapes, abductions and murders under the watchful eyes of the very Christian administration of the Holy Roman British Empire at the time of religious division of the Indian sub-continent in 1947 by the Christian British Empire, when half a million people were forced to migrate, Pakistan has never made any certain move towards civilization. Pakistan is a centre of Islamic fundamentalism, extremism and terrorism. Pakistan’s very Islamic army invaded her province of East Pakistan in 1971, killing hundreds of thousands of Bengali Muslims and non-Muslims and raping half a million women ranging 9-69 years in age, in its attempt to create a half breed Pak-Bengal race which would be loyal to Islam and Pakistan. In 1974 Pakistan army invaded its province of Baluchistan resulting in similar calamities. In 1980 Islamist General Zia ul Haq introduced further islamization under the Saudi pressure for introduction of the medieval and tribal Islamic Shariah.. Along with the compulsory public prayers, there were brutal Islamic laws for the very natural sexual acts and for the presumed blasphemy: the repressive Hudood Ordinance and the infamous Blasphemy laws. Thousands of innocent women continue to suffer under these and other Islamic fascist laws for mere allegations. Raped women had been sent to gallows for the crime of being raped. (Islamic Shariah is the only system of law, which punishes the victims: Fatemollah). Pakistani state has proved to be a willing and sinister instrument of the evil Islamic mullah fascism and terrorism. Pakistan created the hated Afghan Taliban and many other such organizations in Afghanistan. Similar organizations continue to flourish in Pakistan and try to create a totalitarian and fascist Islamic state. Despite all tall claims of fight against Islamic terrorism, the evil continues to flourish. Pakistan is undoubtedly a major source of supply for the Iraqi terrorism. Illicit drug trade continues with the blessings of the Islamic mullahs and the ISI (the Islamic Military Intelligence). There are Islamic prostitution centres in every Islamic city of the Islamic Pakistan where abducted and non-Muslim women are forced to suffer. The secular, liberal and rationalist intellectuals continue to suffer in Pakistan like the victims of the infamous Christian inquisition of medieval Europe. While the Christian churches burnt the heretics, Islamic mullahs get them indicted for Blasphemy.

Eternal vigilance is the price of civilization.

III

While fundamentalism, superstition, ignorance, lack of human rights, female genital mutilations, forced seclusion of women within their houses and in their hijabs; religious extremism, fundamentalism, suicide-bombing and Islamic terrorism continue to be the hallmarks of the Muslim states and societies under the influence of the Saudi Islamic Spiritual Empire of the petro-dollars or Iranian Shiite area of influence under its Shiite oil-money; it is high time for the civilized world to wake-up from the stupor of multi-culturism and blind tolerance of the organized intolerance; for the disease is spilling herein already. Many of the acts of the Islamic states and societies, organizations and individuals are barbaric and medieval; the beheading of the innocent hostages, death penalties and murders for religious reasons; chopping of hands and feet; stoning to death of women for getting raped or on accusation of natural sexual intercourse; honor-killing on mere suspicion, suicide-bombings and acts of terrorism; these are indicative of a deep-seated disease. Murder on the name of a merciful Allah is mere hypocrisy.

The rise of Saudi-sponsored extremist Islam is a danger to civilization everywhere. All extremist Muslims are potential terrorists and Allah’s soldiers. There should be no tolerance for this religiously organized intolerance against liberalism, human rights and women’s equal status and other manifestations of our civilization. Muslims in civilized and democratic societies should be required to take the oath of loyalty to the state and democracy. Political right to vote to those whose political loyalties are located in some far off desert is not only harmful but also suicidal for the state as well as for the very ideology and system of democracy. Political right to vote for those who wish to destroy the very system of democracy? Think again, Ladies and gentlemen.

There is no place for optimism for a liberal Islam. Nearly all Islamic states and states have failed to appreciate the basic human rights of their people, their women and their minorities. Saudis and Emirates are the worst offenders; and are the financial godfathers of fundamentalism, extremism and Islamic backwardness everywhere.. Nearly every Islamic country is dangerous not only for itself but for the world as a whole. Pakistan, for example, after supplying Iran and with Korea with nuke-secrets continues to offer the dangerous technology; Vietnam and Brazil are the new customers. The nuke-terrorist Dr. Abdul Qadir Kahn is safe, well protected and facilitated by the State of Pakistan, with full impunity, of course.

You civilized people! Yesterday you refused to acknowledge the dangers inherent in the rise of the Christian Nazi and Communist ideologies. Yesterday you supported Islamic Taliban even when they trampled rights of their women under their feet. Your refusal to confront militant Islam today may cost us more dearly than our individual lives-our cherished achievement -our civilization. Beliefs have consequences-the centrality of Islam to mental, social, intellectual and cultural backwardness; organized offences against women and minorities; fundamentalism, extremism and modern terrorism are impossible to deny. “Religions of peace and tolerance” are mere empty words.

Islam is an organized crime against humanity!
pigblood on November 2, 2007 1:15 pm
Just shows how fragile the Indian society really is. i truly believe that it is near impossible for muslims to coexist peacefully with others; their dumb monotheistic views have resulted in their refusal to accept others(we all know it’s true!!!!). happy to see that Hindus have finally started defending themselves though, finally responded positively to the call to arms by so many.
pigblood on November 2, 2007 1:36 pm
totally agree with the Indian Ayaan Hirsi Ali Firdaus, not that i care about the condition of women in islam but it is after all the dumbest religion on the planet (Houellbecq, Fallaci and Levi Strauss said it before, i’ll merely say it again, this religion is purely n simply devoid of any sense).What touched me more was the part where Firdaus mentions the different compensations that were awarded to victims in Saudi Arabia, and how muslims were above Christians and Hindus etc). Before being accused of extrapolating issues, we all know it’s the hindu-muslim angle that is garnering such attention to the Todi-Rehman case.
pigblood on November 2, 2007 1:46 pm
Gandhi is the worst thing that ever happened to India!!! India got its independence because the situation had become unmanageable and chaotic for the British. Lord Mountbatten said that the country was becoming too dangerous for them, the non-violence bullshit ever posed any danger to the colonizers. Should have sent all the camel-f***ers to Pakistan, would have been the best possible solution.
Mandal P on November 2, 2007 6:38 pm
Police can do anything applying their own power or motivated / directed by the politicians. Rizwanur is not new in our country / state. Mrs Antia Dewan sr officer from health dept bruitly mudered near Bantala, 24 Pgs. That time the veteran CM voiced this is not unusual……like so ….
We (bengali people) have lost the NOBEL for Tagore, every year we celebrate his birthday etc, but never remembered about the NOBEL. even all politician, writer, social reformers everone was silent. Actually top levels in our society are playing like pupet.
Shaukat on November 2, 2007 6:39 pm
Rahul, you are a great bastered. I pitty the mother who has given birth to a person like you. You are a sick man. No religion is bigger than humanity. And we are fighting for a human, not for Hindus or Muslims. You have commented on something about which you have not even half knoledge.

Shaukat Ali Siddiquei
paithanker on November 2, 2007 10:14 pm
pigblood:you proved yourself to be a pig blood.i do not know what religion you belong to.you have all the qualities of a pig.
Mahboob Ali Jafri on November 2, 2007 11:30 pm
Mr.Rahul,it seems that you are very frustated person which i could gather from your comment.. And secondly people like you who seek personal interest in the name religion are threat to the nation…but still its a democratic country hence people like you are scoot free….for your information i’m muslim and my wife is hindu and i’m married for the past 9 years and my inlaws loves me a lot….it is a lesson for people like you…. I’m sure that you belong to banjrang dal…..whatever you have mentioned i’m confident it happened in your family, i have my sympathy with you and your family….. But my dear friend deed of a person cannot to perception for entire community. So change yourself and start respecting huminity before any religionand try to be true indian first then be of any relegion..
vivek on November 3, 2007 11:06 am
I agree with Mahboob Ali Jafri 100%. But gentle people like are too few(less than 1%) in the entire muslim world.One fish is enough to dirty the lake whereas one good deed is not enough to rectify the misdeed of others.Due to this muslim world is viewed in a negative shade.I had lot of good muslim friend as well as clients with whom I had shared diwali ,eid and holi for last so many years. In fact my muslim friends come to my home along with all types of croakers on diwali day to celebrate with us. We take drinks together and share jokes on all religions. But such people are rare. All we need to develop ,educate and encourage such envirounment .After all muslims in India are hindu only. Hindu is nothing but all person living in and around Hindus Valley.
Now coming to main issue, in this case we including media & politicians are focusing too much on this without any stake for justice. Did anyone think that it is Priyanka who is the most sufferer in the entire case as she lost her love,her husband and became a widow at a tender age with no future and complete black spot on her face and still she is not grumbling. So who are we to talk unnecessary so much. After reading so much on this ,I think its high time ,we should have an Act on elopement, which should guarantee a safe living for a couple provided following rules must be applied :
1.Both should be major.
2.Girl should be financially independent, if not then it should be responsibility of the boy to arrange a fixed deposit of at least Rs 5 lkhs of 5 years in the girl’s name only .This test will ensure that the dependent girl will not be left at the mercy of the boy ,if ill treated by the boy after 2/4 years and will reflect boy’s true love before marriage. We all know that during love it’s brain that releases some extra chemical which makes the person blind and as such they ingore all negative effects agaist each other. However these chemical releases only 2 -3 years thereafter person come back to normal sense.It is only after that couple/lover(if not couple) start evaluavating differences and start fightiing leading to various seperation method.(example kareena & shahid,ash & salman, ash & vivek ,etc etc) At this juncture it is only girl who suffer the most. So law should be strong enough to protect the girl. If the girl is finacially strong then she will be able to cope otherwise there will no future for her. WE all should ensure the future of the girl.
Sualeha Rasul karmakar on November 3, 2007 10:00 pm
Mr Rahul….Lets not stereotype the whole situation and create a divide between Hindu & Muslims. Let us all come together and fight for one case-JUSTICE for Rizwanur and his family…

Well, to add here, if it would have been the other way round… a hindu boy marrying a muslim guy and then the bride’s father going ahead and killimg the groom, then most of the people out there-LIKE U, would have made an outcry about Muslims being ‘Terrorists’. WHAT do U have say NOW??

Anyways, would like to let everyone know that I’m a MUSLIM GIRL who has retaliated and revolted against the whole world to unite and get married to a Hindu boy…Its been almost 5 years and we r HAPPILY MARRIED….he loves me like crazy and I love him more than life itself. Our families has accepted us and we are being showered with love from our elders. Would like to add one more point here…We have NOT changed our religion.

It is a known fact that the offenders will still take the same route had a young girl/boy got married someone from another Hindu/Muslim caste, or someone else that they didnâ€™t approve of.

Once again lets all forget the divide of religion and unite and fight for JUSTICE & LOVE.
John on November 3, 2007 10:47 pm
How come people say that it was a murder.Murder story is a goebbelsian lie, repeating it thousand times won’t make it true. The truth is known to everybody and it was a suicide.
Shaukat Siddiquei on November 4, 2007 1:05 am
Rahul, pat, Vivek and Sujata- It seems that you have never loved anyone or else you wouldn’t have written these things. Love is not measured by money, status or religion. Its something magical which happens between two unknown individuals. It changes ones whole identity,a person in love does not even care about death. Rizwan is dead but only for others because he still lives inside Priyanka whose letters show the love which they both had for each other.People like you will never be remembered b’coz you all are not human beings but a production of satan. Its sad to know that we still have people like you who will never let India rise and shine.This is because India will always be ruled by fanatic religious hogs like you. You all are pigs with a mouthful of shit. When you talk you talk shit. Do you think the one lac people who visited Rizwanurs shrine near St.Xaviers were fools ? There are a handful of People like you who think on your terms. I pity people like you who are a frustrated lot with no other work other than criticising a man who is dead. I HAVE A STRONG BELIEF THAT SURELY YOU ALL FOUR BELONG TO “BAJARANG DAL”.
Shaukat Siddiquei on November 4, 2007 1:54 am
Sorry to use your language:
You f**king Arjun, Saale desh ke deemak. Your language shows that you belong to a low class, F**KING illiterate family. I am sorry to use your language. But there is a saying tit for tat. So this is in reply to your thought about muslims. Never dare to use this language “f**k” “f**king” when you face a true Indian. It seems your father is not an Indian but a f**king English man.
sreenath on November 4, 2007 8:59 am
What the f*** did the press do??? nothing..they sell their papers and get recognition. Sorry to say police is above law in our said so democratic country. You love India you get a kick in our asses.

India place where all religions get together oh my god! What do they get riots and killed are many.

These police people are nothing but God in disguise they rule our lives and we damn Indians go and give people votes..What is the independancy level of our Indian youngster who want to cut the issue on caste system, but in return they got to die on some railway tracks, later a note saying suicide. Balls in the bin.

I seem to be frustrated yes I am because this incident has proved that love marriages/marriages are not made in heaven but are made from the s*** of the Indian Law.
Nadine on November 4, 2007 2:29 pm
The sms’ sent by Rizwanur to Ashok Todi or whoever, stating that he was going to commit suicide just before his death leaves one with the doubt that maybe the murderers forced him to send these sms’s before they killed him.

I am a keen follower of this case and my heart goes out to Rizwanur’s family especially his mother. If Priyanka loved him so much then I think she should come forward and speak the truth whether it involves her family or not and whether she has been threatened by them or not. There’s a God above who will take care or her. Whichever way this case goes we all have to remember that there is a bigger judge sitting on high whom we have to face eventually. For your information I am a Christian married to a Hindu for 23 years, with two beautiful kids.
Fie on you Rizwan-haters! « Love’s Ragpicker on November 4, 2007 6:10 pm
[...] monumental collection, apart from my blog where trolls are fewer and arguments more, can be found here and also here,where I decided not to participate any more because the siteowners’ generous [...]
Indians know how to multiply and divide better than anyone else : It’s Indiatime on November 5, 2007 2:08 am
[...] Why did Kolkata police murder Rizwanur Rahman? [...]
paithanker on November 5, 2007 8:33 am
i have been reading the comments from so many people with different views.like five fingers arre not even the same way all people are not even.evry one has got his own thinking.some has positive way and some has negative.while reviewing all above comments,it was revealed that bangla people are more secular than others.they still defend rizwan,which is appreciated.thanks
hindu on November 5, 2007 4:46 pm
I feel sorry for Rizwanur.

However, the blame for his death is not solely on Ashok.
IMO it is on Priyanka too.

Like Muslim girls belonging to wealthy families or to conservative ones take care that they do not end up in a situation like marrying a Hindu guy, Priyanka should have taken care of such a scenario (may be not of murder but of grave pain to her family and to themselves too).

Love is blind - alright. But marriage is not.
Piyush Bhatnagar on November 5, 2007 6:12 pm
Bravo !!! Bravo !!! Bravo !!!

We have read a lot of comments from many brothers from our Muslim fraternity besides others who are whole heartedly supported the Marriage between Rizwanur & Priyanka Todi.

Now will they support with the same gusto their (Muslim) sisters marrying Hindu boys ????

Here the issue governs a certain stakes and therefore no symbolism characterised by so called true Love culminating into marriage between two consenting adults does not hold much space.
Sayantan Dey on November 5, 2007 6:43 pm
I m Mumbaities Christian.
The things should discuss first with Love.Bcoz God is Love we all Indian Knows.And Satan is Hate.If u murder it is greatest crime against Lord.Every problem should be discuss with peace of mind without Criticizing once religion.
Nobody even have right to take his own decision for creating violence. Whatever causes to Rizwan can affects many familes afterward. The beleive of money is totally foolishness. Nobody can judge anyone without Almighty God, becoz all r sinner.
All India please pray for Rizwan Judgement as per Lord. I support Rizwan love, Bcoz true love is eternal.
Every Citizen of India Should take Appropriate action against corrupted politician & industrialist.
No public of India should not vote any Politician Bcoz they r d Violence maker in earth.
I think Indian politician r worst than British Government.
We all Mumbaities niether Votes Nor thinks for our lier politician.
Raju on November 5, 2007 11:30 pm
The CBI has said that there is no evidence that suggests Kolkata-based graphics designer Rizwanur Rehman was kidnapped the day he was found dead.

The CBI interrogated an eyewitness, Indranil Ghosh, who had made the startling claim that Rizwanur was kidnapped on a regional TV channel.

Ghosh had claimed he had seen Rizwanur being abducted from a cinema hall by unknown men. He had also claimed to sent an anonymous mail to the CBI.

“Rizwan was sitting in a taxi. A green car came and parked itself next to Rizwanâ€™s car. The doors opened and Rizwan was dragged into the green car,” Ghosh had claimed.

Ghosh maintains that he remained silent all this while because he felt insecure. He also claims that one of the abductors is a real estate developer in South Kolkata. CBI picked up Ghosh for interrogation from the studio of the channel to which he had made the revelation.

The state CID reportedly concluded earlier that Rizwan’s death was a case of suicide. Evidence available with the CBI so far also points in a similar direction despite the fact that there is a strong case of abetment to suicide against some of the accused.

The CBI has now said it will act against anyone who tries to mislead the investigation.

Rizwanur was found dead under mysterious circumstances on September 21.
He had married Priyanka Todi, the daughter of an influential businessman Kolkata-based businessman.

Sources in the CBI had told CNN-IBN that Priyanka’s father, Ashok Todi may have faked a heart attack to bring his daughter back home. Priyanka left Rizwanur and went to her parents only after she was told that her father had suffered a heart attack.

The CBI has already filed a murder case against Rizwanur’s father-in-law, Todi.

CBI investigators believe it was a lie. CBI sources in Kolkata have told CNN-IBN that the investigators are now collecting medical documents regarding Ashok Todi’s health.

Meanwhile, Rizwan’s family has filed a case against the Judicial Inquiry Commission constituted by the state government to probe the mysterious death.
pat on November 6, 2007 3:41 am
Taufiq,
You big fat a**. Be it “sare jahan se accha” or “vande mataram” if you sing, you bow your head in front of none other than your motherland, your country. You pighead proved that for you guys your allah is greater than your motherland, your country. Such bigot, pseudo-secularist, bastards should be thrown out of the country in allah’s land to go and read namaz 5 times a day and not care about their homeland. You fuc**** as*h***. I will repeat once again, I do not hate a particular religion but I hate such bastards who do 2-side talking and twist the religion to benifit themselves and try to brainwash others.
pat on November 6, 2007 3:47 am
You f***** don’t object to singing “sare jahan se accha” since it was written by some allahma iqbal as you said. But see the greatness of the people of my country, hindus, sikhs, jains, buddhists, christians, who do not care who wrote it but sing in praise of the motherland.
Can you now see the pathetic difference of thinking between you guys and others? IT REALLY STINKS…
Todi on November 6, 2007 11:58 pm
KOLKATA: Rizwanur Rehman’s widow Priyanka Todi has written to her mother-in-law asking her return her personal belongings lying with the family as she did not wish to return to them.

Writing to the family for the first time after Rizwanur’s death, Priyanka in the letter addressed to mother-in-law Keshwar Jahan asked her to return of her diary, greeting cards and dresses, the family’s lawyer Kalyan Banerjee, to whom the letter was handed over after it was received on Monday said.

“The letter said she would send a person to collect her things from Rizwanur’s mother,” Banerjee said.

“She said that she was still to recover from the shock of her husband’s death, but at the same time did not want to return to the Rehman family,” he said.

Computer graphics teacher Rizwanur was found dead on September 21, following his marriage to industrialist Ashok Todi’s daughter Priyanka on August 31.
Neila on November 7, 2007 1:30 pm
Why some people are against Islam plz see below:
Srinagar, January 19, 1990. Jagmohan arrives to take charge as governor of Jammu and Kashmir. Farooq Abdullah, whose pathetic, whimpering, snivelling government has all but ceased to exist and has gone into hiding, resigns and goes into a sulk. Curfew is imposed as a first measure to restore some semblance of law and order. But it fails to have a deterrent effect.

Throughout the day, Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front and Hizbul Mujahideen terrorists use public address systems at mosques to exhort people to defy curfew and take to the streets. Masked men, firing from their Kalashnikovs, march up and down, terrorising cowering Pandits who, by then, have locked themselves in their homes.

As evening falls, the exhortations become louder and shriller. Three taped slogans are repeatedly played the whole night from mosques: ‘Kashmir mei agar rehna hai, Allah-O-Akbar kehna hai’ (If you want to stay in Kashmir, you have to say Allah-O-Akbar); ‘Yahan kya chalega, Nizam-e-Mustafa’ (What do we want here? Rule of Shariah); ‘Asi gachchi Pakistan, Batao roas te Batanev san’ (We want Pakistan along with Hindu women but without their men).

In the preceding months, 300 Hindu men and women, nearly all of them Kashmiri Pandits, had been slaughtered ever since the brutal murder of Pandit Tika Lal Taploo, noted lawyer and BJP national executive member, by the JKLF in Srinagar on September 14, 1989. Soon after that, Justice N K Ganju of the Srinagar high court was shot dead. Pandit Sarwanand Premi, 80-year-old poet, and his son were kidnapped, tortured, their eyes gouged out, and hanged to death. A Kashmiri Pandit nurse working at the Soura Medical College Hospital in Srinagar was gang-raped and then beaten to death. Another woman was abducted, raped and sliced into bits and pieces at a sawmill.

In villages and towns across the Kashmir valley, terrorist hit lists have been floating about. All the names are of Kashmiri Pandits. With no government worth its name, the administration having collapsed and disappeared, the police nowhere to be seen, despondency sets in. As the night of January 19, 1990, wears itself out, despondency gives way to desperation.

And tens of thousands of Kashmiri Pandits across the valley take a painful decision: to flee their homeland to save their lives from rabid jihadis. Thus takes place a 20th century Exodus.
Piyush Bhatnagar on November 7, 2007 3:49 pm
I think we have had enemies among ourselves like Nehru, other socialists and demented swines in communists else we could have had a pure, eternal, prestine RAM RAJYA bereft of beef eating, despisable Muslims in this land of great BHARAT.

It is high time for us to pick assertive hindu leaders like Narenra Modi who could show them the way out of this Holy Land of Aryavarta.

We must shun those eunuchs who call themselves as secularists but yet help further the mission of Islam and vouch for the minorities in this land.

If these moushis pick up 1 Priyanka then we must ensure to pick up 10 of their sisters without giving damn to these spineless, utterly hungry media and the candle light vigils enunciated by some moushi’s born pigheads.
paithanker on November 7, 2007 9:45 pm
you son of a bitch,don’t you know how many non muslims are eating beef today.what is hamburger? it is made of beef.if you come and see in america all those shakaharis have become non vegetarian and eating beef sandwitches.do not blame to others.
TAUFIQ on November 7, 2007 9:53 pm
pat your are a pagan and follow religion of jungle/stone age so you won’t understand the concept of theology in islam,because in your religion there is no sense and that’s why nobody outside indian subcontinent accepts hinduisum as it’s load of rubbish. wherelse islam is the fastest growing religion in the world especially in west. for your information every year thousands of whites convert to islam do some research asswhole and don’t just keep farting.
i don’t have anything against my country i love it more than you all fart and no shit guys.
akbar on November 8, 2007 12:30 am
The pig heads abuse Hinduism r terrorists and should be fried in pig fat alive.
pat on November 8, 2007 1:58 am
Taufiq,

>> i donâ€™t have anything against my country i love it more than you all fart and no shit guys.

Which country are you talking about? PAKISTAN??? U asshole. You guys never had allegience to India and you never will. Thats your problem; you think yours is the only true religion and everyone else’s is religion of stone age/jungle. When will you group up? Stop going to your madrasas or holding the finger of your qazi and you will come to know there is much more in this world than your islam.

You fuc**** pighead are given incorrect information by your leaders that your religion is growing since a lot of them are converting… What a joke :):) I fell from my chair while reading your statement. YOU A******… your religion is growing because you people have no other work than blowing up innocent people … This is the truth of your growing religion…
taufiq on November 8, 2007 4:05 am
reality stings, as it does to you i can’t carry on this discussion any further coz i think you are another ignorant pagan as you all are, and debating with you is like banging my head in the wall. you don’t have any knowledge of the what’s going around in the world you can just swear and fart sitting there, instead do some research and find out yourself if any of the claims i made are wrong.
pat on November 8, 2007 6:21 am
Taufiq,
Man.. You are so funny. You will definately get a job as a joker in the circus.

Can you think of a good reason why you guys are f****D up all around the world by different civilizations? Around the world you are being bombed WHY???

Get your head straight first and then think about debating with someone…

GET LOST…
TAUFIQ on November 8, 2007 2:47 pm
yes it’s been happening but since last 50 or so years but what about centuries of muslim rule and invader coming to india and kicking your ass you guys do not have balls to step foot out of india wherelse muslim invader have conquered parts of europe in early 1100 we have ruled spain for 500 years.
educate yourself and get out of that shit hole you are living in
TAUFIQ on November 8, 2007 3:14 pm
yes we are being bombed coz they feel threatened by us they don’t have to worry about you coz they know you are pussies and will lick their asses. you have been slaves all your history so don’t have anything to be proud, you are a frustrated lot.
Piyush Bhatnagar on November 8, 2007 4:10 pm
Let me add to the spicy yet bull shitting utterances of some moushis in this site. There has been 3 types of human kinds in this world.

1. God MAN
2. Man MAN
3. Animal Man

It is but obvious that the type under category
1) God MAN would always have been least visible on the terrestrial fermament of the cosmos i.e., likes of Buddha, Mahabir, Tulsi, Ramkrishna and their able torch bearers. But you do not have parellel of such great souls anywhere in world in any historical period apart from Bharat.

2) Man MAN are those who have exhibited immense potential to attain greatness of
the maker of this universe to a great extent in their respective field of work. That the likes of Shakespeare, Einstein, Tansen, Mozard, Tagore, Gandhi and their keen followers who have honestly tried to emulate them their icons.

3) Animal MAN : there has never been any dearth of such dolts on the horizon through out the history……..call them as demons, Asuras, Pariah and all such evil spirits who are huge in numbers and breed faster than the wind. They are the epitome of the Satan of the modern society and make no mistake, they are none other than MUSLIMS, who have infested the world only to break the hell loose all over the world and ultimately perish like worm. A religion which is born out of violence and vengeance how could they profess peace and promote fraternity. It is preposterous and gullible on the part of us to believe there are one among us.
Abhijeet on November 8, 2007 4:39 pm
Honestly speaking the biggest problem with Islam is they dont believe in any other religion and in 99.9% cases the boy or girl have to convert to Islam for recognition. Therefore it is unacceptable for any other community to see their sons or daughters getting married to a Muslim person. It is in the interest of the individual community the girls and boys must be taught that they should not marry any girls or boys outside their commmunities to preserve the values of thier communities and you see in Kerala the Hindu communities are wiped out completely accept for a few Hindu’s remaining in that state.
Shankar Mahadevan on November 8, 2007 9:54 pm
Taufik, i agree 100% with you. Abe saale Pat aur Piush Bhatnagar. Shaitaan ke aulads. Tum log sahi mayne me Hindu nahi ho saalon, Maa ki choots. Suar ke bachchon pehle Indian bano warna maa ke choot men ghuskar phir se paida ho jao. Is baar jab nikalna to Indian bankar, Hindu bankar nahin. Main ek hindu hoon aur meri maan ne Muslim ko chodkar mujhe paida kiya hai to kya mai muslim ho gaya na ki hindu ho gaya ? Behan ke choots, stop debating on religion. Tum log mere samne aao to tum dono ko main nanga karke pel doonga.
pat on November 9, 2007 3:45 am
Taufiq,
Seriously man… How many time do I have to say that you are REALLY FUNNY :):)… You talk about ruling the world and all bull****….. 700 years back the war were fought using swords and bow and arrows… Now the wars are fought using missiles, guns and bombs… You s****s have none and you are still fighting with swords and bows and you dream of winning and conquering the world :):) SO FUNNY MAN… Go and update your GK… US is kicking your ass in Afganistan, Iraq and Northen Pakistan…. Russians are kicking your a** in Bosnia…. Israelies are banking you in Palastine… Chinese are f***ing you in North Western China… and Indian armed forces are f***ing you in Kashmir…. Get a hold of yourself and get a sense of the situation…. Its still not late to convert to Hinduism, Christianity, Bhuddism, Jainism, Sikhism, Jews etc.
taufiq on November 9, 2007 3:30 pm
you are so pathetic you don’t have an independent way of thinking you assholes feed on what the mainstream media gives you. also how big hypocrites you are when cases like the rizwanur’s happen you critisize the media coverage.
asshole in all those countries you have mentioned me where muslims are suppressed let me tell you we have fought back and given them quite big losses the only difference is that mainstream media does not get access to it or they are bais.
even if you don’t believe it atleast we are fighting back you guys did’nt have balls to fight back when we kicked your asses in india for centuries
Raj on November 9, 2007 8:39 pm
Very tragic incident….why parents interfere n the lives of their child….?..Child’s happiness is the happiness of the parents ?..when people would understand it….The guilty must be punished….
pat on November 10, 2007 1:49 am
Taufiq,
By INDEPENDENT THINKING if you mean calling your religion great and others jungle/stone age religions then you definately need to grow up. I think I am talking to a 10 year kid. You are so ignorant to history and refuse to change your lifestyle. You guys still live in the stone age and think you can win by throwing stones at others. :):) I really get entertained by reading your comments everyday.

MUSLIMS ARE SUPRESSED. Why all over the world only muslims are supressed?… Because thats the place where you should be.. at the feet of others… You ass*****..

You talk about FIGHTING BACK… We indians hold you mullas back for 7 centuries… Imagine that for a fight back… Everytime you tried to lay foot on the heartland central india, the rajputs, the marathas, the orrisa kings, the assam kings, the nepalis, the vijayanagri kingdom kicked your ass and sent you realing back to the north…. You can see the pathetic state of you mullas by the time of independence from the british, you had to beg for a seperate country…

But you won’t know that, would you? They don’t teach this in pakistan, do they? They just teach you to kill innocent people so that you can have 72 virgins in heaven… It is so funny… When you guys reach HELL, instead of 72 virgins you have someone else who FU**S YOU….
Karmarger on November 10, 2007 1:29 pm
HOW TO STOP ISLAMIC TERRORISTS . . . it worked once in our History . . .

Once in US history an episode of Islamic terrorism was very quickly stopped. It happened in the Philippines about 1911, when Gen. John J. Pershing was in command of the garrison. There had been numerous Islamic terrorist attacks, so “Black Jack” told his boys to catch the perps and teach them a lesson.

Forced to dig their own graves, the terrorists were all tied to posts, execution style. The US soldiers then brought in pigs and slaughtered them, rubbing their bullets in the blood and fat. Thus, the terrorists were terrorized; they saw that they would be contaminated with hogs’ blood. This would mean that they could not enter Heaven, even if they died as terrorist martyrs.

All but one was shot, their bodies dumped into the grave, and the hog guts dumped atop the bodies. The lone survivor was allowed to escape back to the terrorist camp and tell his brethren what happened to the others. This brought a stop to terrorism in the Philippines for the next 50 years.

Pointing a gun into the face of Islamic terrorists won’t make them flinch. They welcome the chance to die for Allah. Like Gen. Pershing, we must show them that they won’t get to Muslim heaven (which they believe has an endless supply of virgins) but instead will die with the hated pigs of the devil.

Subject: How to end the war quickly if you have absolutely no respect for pigs!

An Israeli friend recently informed me that the UK fought the Islamic terrorist attacks by burying the criminals with a pig. Apparently the Islamic belief is that if ones’ body is buried with a pig (because they are considered unclean) their soul will go to hell. I did a little research into this subject matter and found it to be true. This got me thinking.

If we put a baby pig on every airline flight then all suicide terrorists would abort their missions as they would not want their souls to go to hell. Additionally, if we drop shipped, oh say, 100,000 pigs into Afghanistan I think our recon and assault efforts may be more successful. Apparently Muslims dislike the very sight of pigs A LOT!

They are also adamantly opposed to alcohol, thus we spike their water supply with a few thousand gallons of moonshine, get them drunk and turn the pigs loose. The war would be over in a weekend.
savita on November 11, 2007 4:05 pm
the comments of mr. rahul on 29th sept 2007 reflects how ignorant he is. he should not forget that there are certain bad person in islam and so does in hinduism. considering these people’s misdeeds one cannot see the community as a whole negitively..if some rascal muslims have sold their wives to dubai’s sheikhs so there are indeed instances of rascal hindus selling their wives in the brothals of mumbai, delhi, kolkata etc..its not the religions that are bad, its a small bunch of people who are bad..mr rahul please change ur mindset…..LOVE IS GOD AND GOD IS ABOVE ALL RELIGION. RIZWANUR AND PRIYANKA HAD DONE NOTHING WRONG BY FALLING IN LOVE AND MARRYING EACH OTHER..HATS OFF!!! TO MY FELLOW CALCUTTANS FOR THE WAY THEY HAD AND ARE PROTESTING RIZWANUR’S DEATH AND CARRYING FORWARD THE CRUSADE AGAINST THE CORRUPT POLITICAL AND ADMINISTRATION SYSTEM..AT THE TRAGEDY OF RIZWANUR’S UNNATURAL DEATH I DO OFFER MY HEARTY CONDOLLANCES TO MRS. PRIYANKA AND THE RAHMAN FAMILY PARTICULARLY HIS MOTHER MRS.KISHWAR JAHAN…I PRAY TO GOD THAT MAY JUSTICE PREVAILS.
S.Sikdar on November 12, 2007 12:49 am
We speak our Mind?Then fall into trap.You know what we are doing?Interesting!Feeding all the germs and let them cultivate!Whats the use?Same personnels will come back and ensure that rukbanur and hios familily is finished.That what they are best in Doing.These people are so inhuman that they can drag Rizs mother to thana and make her run 2 kms semi nude.These people care only for money.Tell me who is the main person behind all these?Its TOdis!Money buys everything.Its all about money.They should pay for it this time.He (Riz had no money power)Simple.Cross any club in YOUR Kolkata,you will find lot of devils in gentleman suite.Big Family background with larger than life social life and image,Do you think you can really do something against such GREAT IMAGES OF THIS SOCIETY.We are in coma not realizing what a person can feel when stripped naked in LAL BAZAR and asked to name his father?For what?Riz afraid to face simolar consequences.Not everybody has such documents well in line as that of Riz.He is no more but will he be able to kill this policing/Social bankrupcy?Tens of hundreds are everyday brought fro all over india to Lal bazar to extracty money how?why?Media please can you searxch for a ans?Kolkata police Jurisdiction?Anywhere in India.X check with files.Mindless people are living in City to get rich overnight so they spend some portion whats wrong in this mindless society?wec arae today living in the edge.Muslim?(I am a hindu too loyal)I,think like riz are examples of society.Making a gap of Hindu and Muslim is what extortinist wants But By God its not what they will achieve.I promise.Humiliation to such an eaxtent that one can anyday decide to take his/Her life,tahts what they want.fall into their trap they win we stare at empty sky and till date wonder what we are.Sound Of a SUMO?R they here again?Scared.all of us are scared.
vivek on November 13, 2007 3:59 pm
Some members of the Todi family spoke to TOI about the incidents that transpired since Priyanka left her father’s home on August 31. This is the family’s version of the events surrounding Rizwanur Rahman’s death.

Rizwan’s last call Ashok Todi woke up on that day around 9 am. The family had reached Tirupur, where the Todis have a house and a factory, the day before.

He was in the toilet when his cellphone rang. The number was Rizwan’s. Since August 31, there had been no communication between them. So he was scared to see Rizwan’s number so early in the day. The connectivity was very poor but he recognized Rizwan’s voice. Rizwan said, “Papa baat kariye.” (Papa, talk to me). He didn’t want to talk and kept the cellphone down without disconnecting it. The call lasted 147 seconds and got disconnected. Then came two SMSes in which Rizwan said he would kill himself in five minutes.

Rizwan had also mentioned a letter that he had left for Ashok. Where is it? What did it contain? Did someone suppress it? Had Ashok spoken to him, he wouldn’t have sent the SMS. Ashok then called up brother Pradip and told him about the call. He also asked Pradip to enquire if anything had happened. Ashok received no call from Lalbazar that day. It was late on September 21 night that he learnt Rizwanur had died.

The bond

It was signed at Lalbazar on the insistence of Rizwan and Rukban, his elder brother. On the night of September 7, Pradip requested police to arrange a meeting with Priyanka. Ashok was ill and wanted to see her. The next day they came to Lalbazar. Pradip couldn’t go, so their cousin Anil Saraogi was sent. When she was told about Ashok’s condition Priyanka agreed to go.

The brothers wanted a written assurance that she would return. Then they asked for an hour’s time. The two along with Priyanka went to the visitor’s enclosure at Lalbazar and made several calls. They decided that a bond of seven days had to be signed before she left. Anil called up Ashok and told him about it. On receiving consent from Ashok, he signed the bond and Priyanka went to her father’s home.

Ashok had low pressure. On September 10, they left for Tirupati. Father and daughter spoke only after reaching Tirupur. Ashok wanted to know whether she had married willingly or had been trapped. Priyanka told him she loved Rizwanur. He told her how her actions might affect the impending marriage of two of her cousins. She agreed to wait. On September 11, she spoke to Rizwan from Saraogi’s cellphone. She had left behind her cellphone at Rizwanur’s home, which was later seized by CBI. She asked Rizwan if he would wait, to which he agreed. So the bond was rendered irrelevant.

The letter

We learnt about Priyanka’s marriage on August 31, when she left for Rizwan’s residence. The letters sent to police were written on August 31. Before that none of the family members had any inkling about her marriage. She was probably scared that her father won’t allow such a relationship.

When they wrote the letter to police officers including ex-police commissioner Prasun Mukherjee, they were at Tiljala Lane and probably under the influence of a Rahman family member. Priyanka has told us that someone else wrote the letters and then asked Priyanka and Rizwan to sign them.

For three hours, Priyanka was interrogated alone by CBI. Did she say that her father had threatened them?
In his note to civil rights organisation APDR, Rizwan had stated: “till this day (September 19) no harm has been done to me either physically or through threats.” He was speaking his mind then. By then he had stopped staying at his family house in 7/B Tiljala lane.

Rizwan’s background

To Ashok Todi, Rizwan appeared to be an educated, well-behaved man. He wanted time to make up his mind about the match. He never tried to break the marriage. He only wanted to be sure that Priyanka really loved Rizwan and whether the boy had any ulterior motives. Any father would do this. On August 31, when he spent the night at the Tiljala lane house, she was surrounded by 10 people. They wouldn’t allow him even one minute to talk to his daughter alone. It wasn’t possible then to speak intimately with her on an issue related to the family’s honour.
After Priyanka came back he told her that he wanted to find out about the boy’s background. This was after the two had agreed to wait for each other. She gave him the go-ahead and Pradip, who was in Kolkata all this while, started making enquiries.

At that time Priyanka told her father about his past relationship. Rizwan’s sister-in-law had told Priyanka about this girl and also gave her the girl’s number. Priyanka wanted to know why the two couldn’t get married. Priyanka loved Rizwan and didn’t want any thing to come in their relationship. The phone number was passed on to Pradip who met her on September 13. Priyanka too talked to her.

We also wanted to know how much he earned, his prospects. Our plan was we would solemnise Priyanka and Rizwan’s marriage after the marriage of Priyanka’s cousins. Then they would have settled in some other metro.

Some questions

Why did Rizwan move out of his house before September 21? That day, he called up everybody â€” Ashok, his wife Bimala, friends, lawyers â€” but didn’t make a single call to his brother or mother. Why? He never came to the Salt Lake house nor gave a call to Pradip. If Ashok was threatening him, why should he try to talk to him?
vivek on November 13, 2007 4:00 pm
In his note to civil rights organisation APDR, Rizwan had stated: “till this day (September 19) no harm has been done to me either physically or through threats.” He was speaking his mind then. By then he had stopped staying at his family house in 7/B Tiljala lane.
Shekhar on November 13, 2007 5:06 pm
Ashok Todi is still active, through his men. He is still buying the two eyewitnesses who saw Rizwan’s body first. He is silencing all other witnesses since he is not in jail but outisde the bars !

Rizwan never addressed Ashok Todi as Papa and all his previous sms (as per Priyanka’s own confession) are in English. This means Ashok Todi’s Hindi speaking goons were sending sms from Rizwan’s mobile (and they could type sms in English anyway so they sent in Hindi).

Rizwan’s death was per planned and in full knowledge of Kolkata Police as per pre agreed deal. That how Todis went out to Tirupur so that their goons are on act while they are out of town.
INDIAN on November 16, 2007 1:53 am
All those BULLSHITTING about rights of women in islam, here is the truth about status of women in islam

http://www.rediff.com/news/2007/nov/15saudi.htm

How much you yell, you treat women as shit in islam.
Matt on November 16, 2007 5:04 pm
For such a peaceable country, India is so full of religious hatred. Why? If India cannot square the circle with regard to religious tolerance, then what hope is there for the more aggressive and corrupt west? None I would venture.

Money is the new religion, and it is tearing the world apart. It transcends all other religions and people will do anything to get their hands on it, but as we say in Britain, “You enter the world with nothing, and you leave the world with nothing.”

Now we have ‘genetic modification’ to contend with, there is the very real possibility that the rich, and those that aspire to be so, will clone themselves so as to pass their money onto themselves. Isn’t that completely sick? And it is happening already.

Peace
Piyush Bhatnagar on November 16, 2007 6:35 pm
Matt….we fully agree with you and that’s why India has not only tolerated but happily nurtured all other religions with equal respect and dignity. But if we find that others take us for granted then they have to pay for it.

People demand complete freedom of expression for all aesthetic media and therefore some intellectuals supported M.F.Hussain’s naked portrayal of Goddess Saraswati as artistic liberty. Contrary to that when it comes to Taslima Nasreen and Salman Rusdie then these Muslim go berserk, they cannot take it as writer’s liberty to express his or her emotions.

We must have common civil code for all, no personal law, no concession for Haj, no reservation for minority. Muslims living in this country must chant “Bande Mataram” before calling out Allah at the top of their voice. It is only then they will be taken into mainstream.

We as a Hindu do not rejoice at their vulnerability as week, backward, illiterate and people clinging to rotten thought process. But to reverse the process they must jettison those baser, instintive mindset by accepting better ideas and sublime wisdom of great seers of the past born in this great country where they to have been born while leading an ignomious, wretched life style which people of the developed world look down upon. They should learn to look within and not without for coming up in life.

If you take India without the 30% of Muslim population is quite better off than many other developed countries.
paithanker on November 17, 2007 8:27 am
hey INDIAN do not quote rediff,com.if you have anything from the holy book quran, just mention that with references of page numbers of the book.i think quotations from quran are authentic not the rediff.thank you.
Ravi Kant Ravi on November 19, 2007 3:11 pm
Rahul is quit right. I support him.
The muslims always do this kind of mischief but never a hindu.

Rizwan should have consent of priyanka’s father before marriage, after all he was her teacher he should teach her right things and should not mislead her for his benefit.

Every one know about the diff. in muslim and hindu families so every muslim should keep caution before marriage with a hindu girl.

The persons like Rizwan should be punished like same way to prevnent this type of mishappens with hindu females.
An Indian on November 20, 2007 4:49 pm
The point of relevance in Rizwanur’s case is simply:
1. A Muslim boy marrying a Hindu Girl
2. A Poor boy marrying a Rich Girl.

I understand that Rizwanur was immensely honest very educated, and very nice guy. But was he courageous?

If he was courageous why he did not bring Priyanka’s father into confidence before marrying Priyanka? He obviously very well knew the outcomes so he decided to marry Priyanka secretly. If his love was true and if he had trust and faith on his Allah, he should have confronted the situation and should have married with due confidence of Priyanka’s family.

I am not interested in knowing that Riz was Muslim or Hindu or Christian.

I am more interested did he act prudently in managing this situation? I wonder if he had courage to face the situation. Instead of secretly marrying the girl, why didnt he chose
the path of the facing Ashok Todi and convince him.

I am sure he knew very well that he would have met the same resistance and he lacked the courage to face the consequences.

With CBI also indicating that this was suicide I wonder if Riz had the courage to stand by his decision of marriage after the infatuation would have declined in an year.

I condemn the act of Police, but at the same time I also condemn Riz’s judgement to runaway with Priyanka and getting married with her secretly. Its nothing but an act of coward.

If Riz’s love was true he should have chosen the difficult path and not the short cut.
Real Secular on November 21, 2007 3:29 am
S***h***s like Rajib, Taufiq and all such P**s you need to read this

Congress Party Definitions: Congress Says……….
November 19, 2007 by secularindia

*Congress says:
*Muslims getting killed by a few hundred is no less than a holocaust;
*But poor protesters getting shot in West Bengal under Left Govt is just a
plain misunderstanding; 3,000 Sikhs getting slaughtered in thousands was
only a big mistake; and 300,000 Hindus becoming refugees and thousands dead
due to Islamic terrorists in Kashmir is a only political problem. ** *

*Congress says:
*Congress denying Lord Rama’s existence was simply a Clerical Error. *But
BJP saying it hurt Hindu sentiments is communal!*

*Congress says: *

Haj subsidies for Muslim pilgrimage worth 3000 crores funded by Hindu tax
money is secular;
*But Hindus questioning how their hard earned money is used are communal;*

*Congress says: *
Banning Da Vinci Code and Jo Bole So Nihaal was Secular
*But Modi Banning Parzania in Gujarat was Communal;** *

*Congress says: *

Chinese invasion in 1962 was just an ‘unfortunate betrayal’;
*Kargil attack during BJP Rule was Government failure;*

*Congress says:
*Reservation in every school and college on caste lines strengthen society;
*But same reservations in minority institutions is Communal; *

*Congress says: *
Fake encounters under Cong-NCP in Maharashtra [Khwaja Younus] was only an
instance of Police atrocity;
*But Fake encounters in Gujarat [Sohrabuddin] was Modi sponsored ‘BJP’
Communalism;*

*Congress says: *
Talking about Islam and Muslim appeasement is Secular;
*But talking about Hindus and Hindu concerns is dangerous and Communal; ** *

*Congress says: *BJP freeing 3 terrorists to save Indian hostages was
Shameful;
*But freeing 4 militants to save the life of the daughter of a minister
[Rubina Sayed] was a Natural Political dilemma;*
*Congress says: *
Attack on Parliament was the result of BJP ineptitude;
*But Congress Not hanging Afzal Guru,the mastermind despite Supreme Court
orders is due to Humanity and Political dilemma;*

*Congress says: *
(*Manmohan) Muslims have the first right on India’s resources ;*
*But Hindus questioning it is communal;*

*Is there any end to Congress’ shameless hypocrisy?*

http://secularindia.wordpress.com/

Also see

How to become an Intellectual in India

http://secularindia.wordpress.com/2007/11/19/how-to-become-an-intellectual-in-india/
hena komol on January 27, 2008 4:54 am
f*** all kind of religion. no god , every thing create by stupid human.
CBI rules on Rizwanur case, declares suicide, rejects murder : It’s Indiatime on February 28, 2008 3:52 pm
[...] Why did Kolkata police murder Rizwanur Rahman? [...]
Ganesh on March 10, 2008 11:48 pm
The police officers took money from the Todi’s and had Rizwanir popped off.
Abby on March 12, 2008 1:35 pm
MOst of us here are arguing on what if this happened and what if that happened.The only thing I can say that “Priyanka Todi” is the coward of this century and a curse in the name of Love.When the two decided to lead a life togather,then how come now she is backing a murder is really astonishing.

Shame on you Priyanka.
Piyush Bhatnagar on March 18, 2008 5:58 pm
Priyanka has brought ignominy to her family which has given her so much. No ordinary mortal could ask for more but yet she had thrown her senses to the winds by courting a lowly bred Muslim boy and marrying him without foreseeing the consequences.

While the boy, who was quite old enough to know his bearing, had chose to see an absurd dream which could only be seen in a second rated movies and not in the real life. As a result he had to pay the price, as the quirk of the destiny would have it the quixotic romance had a very painful ending by death of one of the protagonists. We pray for his soul may rest in peace.

However we should remember this old adage that one should cross the “Lakshman Rekha”.
Piyush Bhatnagar on March 18, 2008 6:01 pm
Priyanka has brought ignominy to her family which has given her so much. No ordinary mortal could ask for more but yet she had thrown her senses to the winds by courting a lowly bred Muslim boy and marrying him without foreseeing the consequences.

While the boy, who was quite old enough to know his bearing, had chose to see an absurd dream which could only be seen in a second rated movies and not in the real life. As a result he had to pay the price, as the quirk of the destiny would have it the quixotic romance had a very painful ending by death of one of the protagonists. We pray for his soul may rest in peace.

However we should remember this old adage that one should not cross the “Lakshman Rekha”.
sarannya on April 1, 2008 3:01 pm
RIZWANUR LIVES FOREVER IN THE REAL HEARTS OF YOUNG KOLKATA …nd mr. fat faggot todi n his false n fake hearted daughter priyanka todi must be interrogated by 3rd degree as long as they feel the pain that Rizwanur feels at his last moment…now comes our so called helpful n legall judging glorious 30th goverment gets often shut with lumpsum’s and our police commissioner of kolkata [f]police[mr, proshun mukharjee]is directly responsible for that…nd we guys nomore give a f**K bout kolkata police coz they are selling at a very cheap rate in cozi stores. we just want the rite judgement. so our genaration have to stand and protest against the sh*t old system………………………………!!!
so, don’t let ur mind 2 forget the rights for rizwanur rahaman nd also don’t let ur feelings 2 get buried with his body.
FROM ROCK N METAL HEART FORUM WE DEDICATE A SONG FOR ONLY ND ONLY U..’RIZWANUR’
Halls of Justice Painted Green
Money Talking
Power Wolves Beset Your Door
Hear Them Stalking
Soon You’ll Please Their Appetite
They Devour
Hammer of Justice Crushes You
Overpower
The Ultimate in Vanity
Exploiting Their Supremacy
I Can’t Believe the Things You Say
I Can’t Believe
I Can’t Believe the Price You Pay
Nothing Can Save You

Justice Is Lost
Justice Is Raped
Justice Is Gone
Pulling Your Strings
Justice Is Done
Seeking No Truth
Winning Is All
Find it So Grim
So True
So Real

Apathy Their Stepping Stone
So Unfeeling
Hidden Deep Animosity
So Deceiving
Through Your Eyes Their Light Burns
Hoping to Find
Inquisition Sinking You
With Prying Minds

The Ultimate in Vanity
Exploiting Their Supremacy
I Can’t Believe the Things You Say
I Can’t Believe
I Can’t Believe the Price You Pay
Nothing Can Save You

Justice Is Lost
Justice Is Raped
Justice Is Gone
Pulling Your Strings
Justice Is Done
Seeking No Truth
Winning Is All
Find it So Grim
So True
So Real

Lady Justice Has Been Raped
Truth Assassin
Rolls of Red Tape Seal Your Lips
Now You’re Done in
Their Money Tips Her Scales Again
Make Your Deal
Just What Is Truth? I Cannot Tell
Cannot Feel

The Ultimate in Vanity
Exploiting Their Supremacy
I Can’t Believe the Things You Say
I Can’t Believe
I Can’t Believe the Price We Pay
Nothing Can Save Us

Justice Is Lost
Justice Is Raped
Justice Is Gone
Pulling Your Strings
Justice Is Done
Seeking No Truth
Winning Is All
Find it So Grim
So True
So Real

Seeking No Truth
Winning Is All
Find it So Grim
So True
So Real
[WORDS BY JAMES HATFIELD,METALLICA]

‘MAY RIZWANUR’S SOUL REST IN PEACE IN HEAVEN’
ayesha on May 21, 2008 1:14 pm
we are suppose to stay in an advance world which is going toward the 20th century dont you think it is a stupidity on those people who say they are educated and bring up a war on the basis of a religion….. pititable state India is going through what can one comment on this….. I dont have any thing to say or comment
sohail on July 23, 2008 10:35 am
dear.
binoy kumar mondal on July 26, 2008 10:50 am
kolkata police up to datemail service not avaliable .
please up to date news
Saroj on September 18, 2008 4:00 am
Ashok Todi paid the cops most probably. Do not let him get away.
Thiagan on September 23, 2008 11:08 am
23/09/08

Non muslim girls marrying muslims are doomed to be a disaster. My objections:

> the girls will be invariably from affluent families and the husband can not afford to maintain her earlier lifestyle
> the girls brought up in liberal circumstances can not adjust to the suffocating surroundings for women in Islam
> in Islam marriage is a contract and can be terminated by the husband by uttering triple talaaq; in Pakistan Hindu girls are regularly abducted, forcibly converted and married off to muslims. Six months later, they are abandoned and they become destitutes. The status of women in Islam is worse beyond imagination.
> I can not accept a teacher marrying his own student; it is against professional ethics.
> the boy has brought dishonour to the family and he should be killed to protect the honour of the family. This is in accordance with shariaat.
> Ram Madhav earlier quoted the instance of a UP senior IAS officer married to a muslim lady. Their son died and there was virtually a war whether to cremate or to bury.
> Culturally they are poles apart and the marriage will never work
> there is a definite attempt by muslim boys to lure Hindu/Christian girls to marriage; it is an effort to increase the market share
> Betty Mohamed, an American lady, married an Iranian doctor and after seven years, she was persuaded to go to Iran with the daughter; the husband became a fanatic and started imposing Arab customs on them. She escaped to USA after great difficulty and she has written a book, â€Not Without My Daughterâ€. It is favourite present when any American girl marries a muslim. It is also filmed
> muslim girls can cope up with marriage because they brainwashed from birth
> US state department has issued a booklet warning American women against marrying muslims
> This is a very relevant concern of every parent and I wish the media should not make circus of it
What is your response?
sam Joseph on October 6, 2008 7:44 pm
Rahul is absolutely right, Every Musslims sees a Hindu, and a christian women with a very dirty sight. The bloody followers of Allah must leave the country, they are cancerous to our society. They are the source of terrorism, because there holy book Quran teaches them about that. how the Muslim religion may good, because there prophet (satans follower) was a murderer he killed millions of innocent jews, christians, raped the ladies of their. He was simply an ill minded he consummated child merely 9 years old her name was Ayesh. He forecely divorced his sons wife to marry her. When people asked them about the sinful deed then he replied that Allah orderd him and The man is not his blood he adopted him. there is lots of thing that you all have to understained the religion you will simply hate the religion because that is satanic. for better understion the satanic religion you have to study the ali sina’s website faith freedom international.
Regards Sam joseph
sam Joseph on October 6, 2008 8:05 pm
What you said Rahul, a pig, Now negotiate with me. I will unveil and make your religion nude.

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